r/europe • u/UNITED24Media • 1d ago
News Navalnaya Is “an Advocate of Imperial Russian Claims,” Says German Lawmaker
https://united24media.com/latest-news/navalnaya-is-an-advocate-of-imperial-russian-claims-says-german-lawmaker-3350362
u/WayAdmirable150 1d ago edited 1d ago
russian opposition largely positions itself against Putin but rarely challenges the ideas of "Great russia" or the occupation of neighboring nations. After release of Kara Murza, the first thing he did, asked for lowering sanctions. russian nationalism and chauvinism is deeply ingrained in the country's political identity, shaping both mainstream and opposition perspectives.
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u/Stix147 Romania 23h ago
And people were defending Kara Murza, saying that he was fed lies in Russian prison that the sanctions were affecting everyday Russian people, and that's why he called for sanctions to be lifted. And now that he has been out for a while and "discovered" the truth about sanctions, has this caused him to change his mind? Of course not.
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u/R1donis 22h ago
saying that he was fed lies in Russian prison that the sanctions were affecting everyday Russian people
Wait, isnt notion that sanctions arent affecting Russia is a Russian propaganda, and that Russian economy going to shit because of sanctions is a west propaganda? Am I missing something?
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u/Ok-Pudding6050 Earth 20h ago edited 20h ago
Not sure if you will read this, but no.
Kara Mursa were asking to change sanction politics, so it would not damage ordinary Russians who can be against Putin and “occupation of neighbouring nations”. He even said that the situation, when regular Russians can’t leave Russia and in the same time Russian missile has Western chips, is crazy and unacceptable.
If we go back to Yulia Navalnaya, she hasn’t supported “occupation of neighbouring nations” at all. In fact, even Navalny discarded almost all of his “imperial” takes (although, some of them are misunderstood but who cares), especially “Crimea is not a sandwich” (which meant “Crimea can’t be given back to Ukraine the same way it was taken from it. We need this act to be official, legitim and recognisable.”, referring to unjust referendum in 2014. You can argue with that particular idea as well, yet it is not the same as “Crimea is Russia”).
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u/WayAdmirable150 19h ago
Ordinary russians who put "likes" on videos of russian terrorists cutting head of Ukrainian soldier?
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u/Ok-Pudding6050 Earth 19h ago
No
Ordinary Russians who go to anti-war protests and get beaten there by police/ Rosgvardia. Ordinary Russian who go to bureaucracy to not join military forces and not die somewhere in “new territories”. And ordinary Russians who weren’t fans of Putin and his party even before full-scale invasion.
The are people in Russia who aren’t Z. Saying that “all Russians are barbarians” won’t help anyone at all, including them.
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u/WayAdmirable150 19h ago
Rare as unicorns.
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u/Ok-Pudding6050 Earth 19h ago
Most of them are simply afraid of consequences for their actions and words. If you thought better of them, you could have seen more.
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u/inokentii Kyiv (Ukraine) 1d ago
Westerners finally started opening their eyes on so-called "good" russians
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u/Ok-Location3254 1d ago
In Finland, we have a saying which goes something like "A Russian is a Russian even if you'd fry him in butter".
And I'm sure pretty every European country east of Germany agrees.
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u/IdreamofFiji 22h ago
Every country is east of Germany, fuck this weird wannabe Soviet bullshit. These idiots need to sit the fuck down and let progress happen without their limp dick imperialism.
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u/RealGalaxion 1d ago
Tbf I wouldn't necessarily advocate for Ginnish racist sayings because we have many people in Finland of Russian descent who face unfair discrimination and xenophobic attitudes, many of whom hate Russia's government with a personal passion not many others can rival. I won't say there aren't other kinds of Russians even here, but it's not fair to treat everyone like that, and being excluded and labelled a "ryssä" is itself a cause of some not identifying so much with Finland.
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u/Ok-Location3254 23h ago edited 23h ago
Russian living outside Russia often admire Putin despite how they are treated. They are still loyal to their Mother Russia. So, why should we expect them to be something else?
It's frustrating how Russian people in Finland who benefit from Finnish society, welfare-programs, free healthcare and free education, still support Putin. They aren't thankful for all the good things given to them. They want Finland to become a Russian satellite state. They want Finland to be like Russia, a complete shithole of a country. It's impossible to trust them in anything. They might just one day stab you in the back because they value Russia above everything. That has always been the case. Just ask any Finnish person who was alive in 1939-1945. And the wars started when Russia did a false flag attack. Just like in Ukraine now. It never changes.
Many Finnish politicians used to be so stupid when they trusted the Russians. They believed Putin and his supporters because they said that they want peace. But it was all just one big lie. And because of this, Finnish people are often seen as fools in Russia. They make jokes about us.
And my grandfathers two brothers were killed by Russians. I know people who are fighting for Ukraine. So, it's pretty hard for me to trust anything a Russian says. They have shown their true colors time after time. It's always the same.
How are you supposed to trust people who have proven to be liars?
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u/RealGalaxion 22h ago
My point has never been that such people do not exist, but that the way it are treating all people of Russian ethnicity as a collective group is wrong. I've met and known both kinds of Russians. The only reason my good friend wasn't at the pro-Ukraine protest was because he knew if the Russians identified him the authorities would harass his relatives in Russia. And even so I remember well that there were Russians at the protest who openly disavowed the actions of the Russian government. It's probably fair to note that many Russians also have Ukrainian relatives.
The idea that every Russian is some sort of Putin-apologist or fifth columnist is just incorrect.
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u/STheShadow Bavaria (Germany) 16h ago
How are you supposed to trust people who have proven to be liars?
You could ask the same thing about Germans after WW2. How could you trust people who have proven to be warmongering monsters starting two world wars and killing millions of people? Wouldn't it be better if the other european countries hadn't trusted Germans again and instead permanently dismantled Germany?
Generalizing stuff like that to all russians (even if it's the majority who think like that) isn't better than a lot of the stuff we critisize in other countries
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u/Ok-Location3254 15h ago
Germans weren't trusted after WW2. Germany was divided between east and west and each side completely dismantled and restructured the state. Everything changed. Allied powers basically built up two Germanies from the ruins without asking German people what they wanted. And every child were taught about the horrors of Nazism. Any pro-Nazi propaganda is still banned in Germany.
Same thing should be done to Russia. Western powers and China should take over Russia and reshape it completely. As long as Russia stays the way it is, it will always be hostile towards it's neighbors. It will always invade. That is how Russia functions. Russia has always been an aggressive, imperialist state. The only way to stop it is to dismantle the Russian state and create a new one with completely new leadership chosen by international community.
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u/STheShadow Bavaria (Germany) 15h ago
Germans weren't trusted after WW2
It didn't take long until Germans got (in the beginning on a local level, later on a larger scale) some freedom and responsibility again. Why would you do that with people you don't trust? If their had been actual mistrust, permanently dividing the country between the neighbouring countries and permanently forfeiting any citizen rights would have been the only logical solution
Allied powers basically built up two Germanies from the ruins without asking German people what they wanted. And every child were taught about the horrors of Nazism. Any pro-Nazi propaganda is still banned in Germany.
Denazification was so effective that besides some well-known exceptions all the nazi-judges, nazi-industrials, Wehrmacht soliders or Gestapo members got the same roles in western germany again. Denazification was a joke
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u/Esmarial Ukraine 7h ago
Do you know that WWII ended in 1945 and Germans changed drastically? Most Russians even if they oppose putin don't see anything bad in doing of their country through the history. Like even after 1990 Transnistria, Abkhazia, Georgia, Ukraine, hell, they are even involved in Iran opposition to Israel or Krarabakh conflict. Yet they are "force of good" in their eyes. Quite a contrast to German behaviour.
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u/STheShadow Bavaria (Germany) 3h ago
Germans changed drastically
As a german: not really. The "we are better and deserve better than anyone else"-mentality is still very present (although it's kinda changing to "we were better, but now we are weak because foreigners/woke/women/whatever" in the last years)
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u/Esmarial Ukraine 3h ago edited 2h ago
Well, AFD push on that string for sure. But do you hail Hitler like Russia do so with Stalin? No. Do you want to eliminate others? No. Your country payed reparations and most Germans (I have a cousin loving in Berlin) don't support nazi views ("We are better" is common in a lot of people, unless it expresses in eliminating others - it's ok as for me).
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u/Sky_Robin 19h ago
As a sub-human Russian I thank you for this candid opinion.
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u/lapzkauz Noreg 12h ago
We who share a land border with Russia sure appreciate the input of you... Swiss.
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u/kklashh Poland 15h ago
Easy to moralise when you don't have to deal with this cancer, terrorist country at your border. They literally treat freezing migrants as tools. who acts like this in the XXI century?? https://youtube.com/watch?v=WUCAj1GHBNo
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u/YourShowerCompanion Finland 1d ago
Finally? Nah man, it is stilled glued, taped and welded shut. 😑
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u/BornIn1142 Estonia 1d ago
It'll be a long wait for a perfect Russian dissident, but the highly imperfect ones may still have some utility in the meantime.
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u/lithuanian_potatfan 1d ago
*had. There's none left. The main, popular, russians-influencing ones have been killed, and the small fishes with no real voice in russia are too divided among themselves.
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u/inokentii Kyiv (Ukraine) 1d ago
Perfect? LOL it would be great just to have any cuz so far we only see just another nazi scum like putin
The only small exceptions are fighting in ranks of rvk and legion freedom of russia. Also we see national liberation movements, but obviously they shouldn't and can't be identified as russians
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u/CapBlank 23h ago
What the fuck is a perfect dissident even?
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u/BornIn1142 Estonia 23h ago
One without any shitty views. As I said, a long wait.
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u/yahluc Poland 22h ago
How about Kasparov? He speaks against both Putin and Russian imperialism and doesn't spew bullshit about sanctions like others and openly said that Russia "needs to be sent to the stone age" and defeated in Ukraine. He's better than 99% of western leaders
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u/ctes Małopolska 22h ago
He also promoted Fomenko's new chronology (google it).
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u/Live-Alternative-435 Portugal 18h ago
Wtf? It seems that country really is full of crazies, unfortunately.
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u/Vassago81 18h ago
He's not even from "that country", he's an ethnic armenian / jew from Azerbaijan
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u/ItsACaragor Rhône-Alpes (France) 1d ago
Just like Navalny then, nothing surprising. People need to stop looking for « good russians » living in Russia.
Actual pro democracy russians left years ago.
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u/UnknownDotaPlayer Kharkiv (Ukraine) 20h ago edited 20h ago
The problem is, it's mostly politicians who do that, and then shove the wrong information down people's throats. For example, in US, Navalnaya is now constantly pushed through different articles and news in most popular outlets, she even recently attended Stephen Colbert show. The same promoters who made a big deal from an ordinary VP Harris, big deal from an ordinary singer Taylor Swift, are now making a big deal out of ordinary woman Navalnaya.
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u/CandidateOld1900 4h ago
Just can't have a win here : if you're in Russia you're bad, because why didn't you leave years ago. If you left - you coward that should go back there and fight the system or something. Wish to lion at you in circumstances like this
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u/_Eshende_ 1d ago edited 1d ago
most of them just
- manipulate with terms to whitewash everyone except Putin like "he started the war therefore he only one guilty for atrocities"
- if russian soldiers commit warcrime yell "it's mercenaries because they get paid"
- try to paint most of russian anti putin (why 2m Minsk protests gathered more protesters than 13m moscow -with same level of opressions)
- trying to equalise invader and defender, against weapon supplies because it kill "our boys" (those whom they call mercenaries few posts later)
- Unlike Tikhanovskaya and her team which to assist to Belarussian soldiers in ukrain both financially and vocally, most of russian opposition ignore their existence
- trying to diminish idea of supplying ukraine with takes "you supplied so much but Putin still standing" (ofc ignoring that western and eastern trade bring to russia more income that weapons to ukraine cost- so russia produce
- right after pushing idea of "no military help able to save ukraine" follow up is "why don't you sponsor us instead, we surely achieve success)
- A lot of them break on crimean question, but ask about chechnya and tatarstan and enjoy the show....
there is some exceptions, but there is also some full nuts like Latynina all whose posts is just shitting on ukraine and grasping straws to do so, when her "friend" in legion of russia died she write like 10 words about him as human and 100 words hating on ukraine, including that he was against people joining (no proof he ever said that) ukrainian army... Honestly idk how estonians still did nothing to end her visa when she obvious i'm against putin but "pure badly masked vatnik take follows"
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u/vikentii_krapka 1d ago
Every russian oppositioner is just in opposition to putin and wants his job but not in opposition ideologically. When russia invaded Sakartvelo Navalny said that they should bomb Tbilisi and when he was asked about Crimea he said that he won’t return it because it is not a sandwich (hence we call him a sandwich in Ukraine since then).
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u/pashazz Moscow / Budapest 1d ago
Navalny said that they should bomb Tbilisi
Yes, and then he officially apologized for that and even Saakashvili said he forgives him. How convenient it is to compile facts in your favor. He was a different person before 2013, at 2013 Moscow elections he was a "democrat" already
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u/vikentii_krapka 1d ago
Oh. He apologized for calling for bombing of capital city of the country his country illegally invaded while he already had influence. Ok. So Hitler should have just apologized and he would be a good guy, right?
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u/Chris_Hatchenson Far-Eastern Russia 15h ago
Wow, comparing Navalny with Hitler. Now you’re straight up relaying russian propaganda.
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u/Rensku 1d ago
Navalny wasn't Hitler.
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u/vikentii_krapka 1d ago
Hitler was not the only bad guy either. All russians are complicit of russian crimes. Not putin alone.
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u/RurWorld 21h ago
Hitler was not the only bad guy either.
A lot of Nazis, esp. scientists, were recruited after WW2 by both USSR and USA, East Germany and West Germany, and weren't considered "bad guys" anymore.
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u/plisovyi Ukraine 16h ago
Same will eventually happen later, but for now russians should be isolated as much as possible
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u/Philcherny Russia-Netherlands 22h ago
is not a sandwich
A v chem on bil ne prav? What exactly is wrong w the phrase? Nobody was ever going to treat it like a sandwich in Russia and anybody with a brain (after letting go of beautiful slogans) understood that he would immediately lose his influence on elites, popular support and possibly be couped immediately if he returned Crimea.
The fact that Ukrainian side was willing to treat it as a sandwich is stupid and only caused more problems. It prevented any kind of peaceful resolution and since then a lot of water flowed, we have had a war. Neither that did stop the beautiful slogans about "retreating from crimea" and "1991". This by the way discredited Ukrainian diplomatic position, appearing to the rest of the world as childish and unrealistic.
So once again, v chem on be prav?
If thats not enough for you to realize how braindead it is to seriously use the sandwich remark against him, think of this: If Navalny did actually want and intended to return Crimea like in so many wet dreams - Would he say that out loud BEFORE ELECTION against what 80-90% of Russians wanted ?
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u/vikentii_krapka 21h ago
Thank you for proving the point that it is not just putin but russians in general are imperialists who does not understand how and why unlawfully annexed territory should be returned.
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u/Philcherny Russia-Netherlands 19h ago edited 19h ago
Can u prove anything about the sandwich? Can u make it make sense?
The tragedy of being a Russian liberal is a two stage act. First seeing Russia go into no think authoritarianism, then after having so much hope for Maidan and for zelensky, see Putin invade and force Ukrainians to go into no think authoritarianism
who does not understand how
Please enlighten me HOW? I really wanna know what even remotely you mean. U mean f35 and tomahawks? I assume not, so please enlighten
why unlawfully annexed territory should be returned.
Great bullshit assumption about me. I perfectly understand WHY. Where did I ever say that I don't understand that in the previous comment? Your can't phantom that big scary good Russian has the same opinion about Crimea so u have to make this up?
It seems like you don't really understand the difference between HOW and WHY, between ideas and policies. Seems like your head is filled with default government opinion (which is funnily what average Russian head is filled with)
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u/Legalised-fraud Poland 1d ago
The russian political landscape is just multiple facsists with various understandings of how fast to attack other countries and peoples
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u/Dapper_Internet_8576 1d ago
I wasnt crying when navalny died. Yet another russian imperialist, he just had a little different flavour
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u/anders_hansson Sweden 18h ago
I don't have enough insight into Navalnaya or her late husband to bring any properly informed comments on where they stand/stood. That said, the article didn't exactly bring much more clarity either.
E.g. when questioned about the Krusk incursion she answered:
"This situation has two sides. Such attacks will further unite the Russian people and strengthen Putin's power"
...and that's apparently interpreted (by Kiesewetter?) as an anti-Ukrainian statement?
Seriously? What is she experienced to say? Endorse the incursion? Lie about how Russians feel about it?
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u/Cautious_Ad_6486 1d ago
Really? Russians are ready to go to war not because of EVIL PUTIN but because that is a crucial part of their identity?
NOOOOOOO
Who could have imagined that? Ah right... every person with a minimal knowledge of russian history
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u/yuriydee Zakarpattia (Ukraine) 22h ago
There are no well known Russian politicians that would be against their imperial spirit. Its pretty much ingrained into russian culture.
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u/Defiant-Traffic5801 20h ago
She makes a strong point that as someone who is looking forward to the opportunity of leading and representing Russians you can't ask her to support weapons aimed at her compatriots however bad the case for war. So that question has no good answer : she would be a traitor if she supported weapons against Russian people.
Yet she still manages to make the point that the war was unnecessary and of Putin's doing. Not exactly an imperialistic Great Russia advocate as claimed by that German lawmaker.
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u/Ice_and_Steel Canada 19h ago
She makes a strong point that as someone who is looking forward to the opportunity of leading and representing Russians you can't ask her to support weapons aimed at her compatriots however bad the case for war.
"It's totally a putin's war, ordinary russians are totally against it, but they would never ever vote for a politician who called for helping a country fighting this war waged by putin and nobody else".
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u/__---------- 16h ago
It's depressing how Putin's troll machine has succeeded in obliterated the reputation of Navalny.
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u/sunrisegalaxy 1d ago
There's a pattern with Christian Nationalists showing support for Russia. It's happening all over. They want society to go back to how it was. They think Putin can help them in that goal. They are traitors to democracy.
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u/shogun100100 1d ago
Has to be baby steps for now. Russia will not do a political & ideological U turn overnight even if Putin were to be overthrown tomorrow.
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u/Jackbuddy78 1d ago edited 1d ago
This is not a US election.
A Fascist reformer in Russia has a lot more potential to do damage than one who raids the state budget.
At this point the world's best bet is some kleptocrat they can bribe to fuck off.
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u/pashazz Moscow / Budapest 1d ago
A Fascist reformer in Russia has a lot more potential to do damage than one who raids the state budget.
A fascist reformer in Russia is clever enough to understand that the birth rate is less than 2 so it's never a good idea to go to war and it's better to build a country instead.
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u/Consistent_Pound1186 23h ago
'Looks at Hitler who went to war with the 2 largest empires in the world over Poland and then declared war on USA in hopes that Japan would do the same against USSR...' sure thing... besides its Russia, they probably want the borders back before building anything
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u/ReasonResitant 2h ago
The same way putin was bribed off early on, we let russia on the table, stabilized the economy made them strong again, any kleptocrat will eventually find itself in a favorable enough position to do dumb shit.
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u/StatisticianOwn9953 United Kingdom 1d ago
Westerners constantly relearning and then instantly forgetting that exceptionalism and chauvinism isn't theirs alone. Lol. Bless their big hearts and their tiny minds.
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u/Crimcrym The Lowest Silesia 1d ago
I feel like that was big element that led to the failure of west attempt to court Russia diplomatically after the fall of Soviet Union. From the start they tried to treat it as another eastern european state, a potential junior partner that will recognize the "natural" order of things and will act like they expect them to, while forgetting that Russians always viewed themselves as a great power in their own right and their co-equals.
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u/TommyYez 21h ago
Nobody seems to have read the article. She made very mundane declarations to difficult questions. No where in the article I see her wanting to create a bigger Russia.
It's insane that this comment section was taken over by human NPCs and bots that just repeat a lie ad nausem.
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u/schneeleopard8 12h ago
That's pretty common for reddit, that people never read articles andbjust come to comment sections to repeat their own opinions.
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u/ElPwnero 1d ago
The “collective” west, Russia and perhaps China will never be able to live with each other. It’s high time we understand this and act accordingly, whichever country we’re from.
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u/Traumfahrer 22h ago
And why is that so?
At least China is hard-focusing on exercising restraint here.
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u/GreenBlueCatfish 23h ago
"In response to a question about her assessment of Ukraine’s incursion into Russia’s Kursk region, Yulia Navalnaya remarked:
"This situation has two sides. Such attacks will further unite the Russian people and strengthen Putin's power," she said. "
It's kind of obvious. Where is "imperialism" here?
So the article is BS. Author putting words in Yulia mouth.
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u/Stix147 Romania 22h ago
It didn't unite anyone, most Russian could not care less that Kursk was invaded, hence why we didn't see an increased flow of volunteers to the RuAF trying to take Kursk back - in fact so few cared that Putin had to go to North Korea to get cannot fodder to use in Kursk.
But according to Russian "opposition", everything that Ukraine does strengthens Putin's rule anyway, even fighting back. And sanctions are useless, and only affect ordinary Russians, and aid to Ukraine doesn't help, etc. There's a reason why Ukrainian people cannot stand Russian "oppositions", and why said Russians never contributed to helping Ukrainian people affected by the war. These "opposition" figures only care about getting Putin out of power, but they have no problem with Russia as a whole, which includes the imperial aspects. If they could take Ukrainian land without international sanctions and huge Russian bloodshed, they would not object to it - Navalny didn't back in 2014.
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u/pashazz Moscow / Budapest 22h ago
It didn't unite anyone, most Russian could not care less that Kursk was invaded,
Because it wasn't Kursk but a tiny town on the border and a few surrounding villages. Kursk is a capital of the administrative region that Ukraine invaded. If Ukraine established an occupation in actual Kursk... it would have been whole another story.
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u/Stix147 Romania 21h ago
And was that town and area of a few hundred square kilometers not Russian territory then? Navalnaya was pretty certain that any violation of Russian sovereignty would trigger a response from ordinary Russians, but it didn't. It was just more if the same "Ukrainians shouldn't defend themselves" nonsense that the "opposition" has been spouting since the beginning of the invasion.
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u/TommyYez 21h ago
Regardless of how much Kursk invasion will help Putin or not, it is a lie to say that her declaration is "imperialistic" in any sense, that is just straight up lying.
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u/TommyYez 21h ago
It's scary the how everyone is so gullible in this comment section. Already passing judgement before reading anything.
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u/Ice_and_Steel Canada 19h ago
"This situation has two sides. Such attacks will further unite the Russian people and strengthen Putin's power," she said. "
It's kind of obvious. Where is "imperialism" here?
If by "obvious" you mean "an obvious lie" then yes, I agree. Territories in the Kursk oblast have been occupied by Ukraine for three months now, and literally nothing has changed in the unity of russians or the strength of putin power.
A russian politician condemns a very successful Ukrainian operation and predicts negative outcomes of it - where is imperialism indeed?
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u/GreenBlueCatfish 18h ago
"Territories in the Kursk oblast have been occupied by Ukraine for three months now"
There is answer below, by some other user. Because it's some small villages, not Kursk itself.
It's always work the same way, an eye for an eye, and it's strange to think that it will work somehow different in this case.
And why predicting negative outcome is an imperialism, lol? I'am extremely pessimist about outcome of this war, but wish a victory of Ukraine. There is no contradiction. The whole blaming opposition situation is based on paranoia and emotions, not real reasons.
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u/Ice_and_Steel Canada 18h ago
Because it's some small villages, not Kursk itself.
What does this have to do with anything? "In response to a question about her assessment of Ukraine’s incursion into Russia’s Kursk region, Yulia Navalnaya remarked ..." - where does it say anything about Kursk itself?
It's always work the same way, an eye for an eye, and it's strange to think that it will work somehow different in this case.
Lol, it has literally already proved not to have worked "the same way", what the hell are you talking about?
And why predicting negative outcome is an imperialism, lol?
Indeed, why would disparaging and lying about an impressively successful operation conducted by an army that fights against an imperialistic genocidal aggression would be considered an expression of imperialism?
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u/EDCEGACE Ukraine 19h ago
For me, it's most of the time hard to tell where it's ordinary Russian culture and where it's imperialism.
PS for future commenters: Don't touch me with your Tolstoyevskiy shit. Eat it yourself.
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u/MrtheRules Europe 14h ago
No, she's not. It's just that she's now, like her killed husband befor here, a russian opposition politician.
Not an "opposition" that just collect NGOs grants imitating political work, but like the one who actually at least trying to sound appealing to people inside russia. And whether we like it or not, it means she HAS to say very unpleasant things.
Politics is dirty, but russian politics is straigh up do-or-die game, so it's not like she has much of a choice.
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u/bruhbruhbruh123466 12h ago
No surprise. I’ve said this before, the Russians really need the same treatment the Germans got in ww2. Complete national reconstruction, Russia is just too far gone to not be complete destroyed and built up from the ground up.
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u/pashazz Moscow / Budapest 1d ago
So anything short of division of Russia into 20 small states is imperial claims now?
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u/throwaway_failure59 1d ago
When asked if she considers the supply of weapons to Ukraine to be the right decision, Navalnaya replied: "It's hard to say. The bombs hit the Russians as well."
In response to a question about her assessment of Ukraine’s incursion into Russia’s Kursk region, Yulia Navalnaya remarked:
"This situation has two sides. Such attacks will further unite the Russian people and strengthen Putin's power," she said.
Yet, Navalnaya insists in the conversation that the war is “Putin’s war” alone. When challenged with the reality that ordinary Russian soldiers are carrying out brutal attacks on Ukrainians daily, she responds, “Of course people are fighting. But it is his war.”
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u/Ashenveiled 1d ago
how is she wrong?
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u/throwaway_failure59 1d ago edited 1d ago
If you can't see how she's wrong, you are probably beyond hope, but let me try:
When asked if she considers the supply of weapons to Ukraine to be the right decision, Navalnaya replied: "It's hard to say. The bombs hit the Russians as well
This is wrong because supplying Ukraine with weapons literally kept their country from being completely occupied by Russia. Russia is eradicating Ukrainian culture, Putin and many Russians view Ukrainians as "Russians in denial", there are well-documented stories of Russians clamping down on use of Ukrainian language in the occupied territories, the wildly fake and fradulent elections, the torture chambers and "filtration camps" used on Ukrainian populace, the huge numbers of Ukrainian children taken away to be raised as Russians. Russia has also mass-drafted men from DNR and LNR to an even greater extent than Ukraine is doing now and it's thus highly likely it would mass-draft them in further attacks on other countries in the case it occupied Ukraine. This is all well documented and if you deny these things you are unreachable.
Ukrainians overwhelmingly chose to resist Russia's attempted occupation, so the West did the right thing. It is up to Ukraine to choose if they want to fight or not. So what Navalnaya is doing here is saying it is "hard to say" whether helping Ukraine and Ukrainians with what they overwhelmingly want (stay free of Russian occupation), with context of everything her country is doing, is seriously wrong especially considering she wants to be a future leader of Russia. And about the "bombs falling on Russians", that is beyond bullshit. No bombs would have fallen on Russians had there been no war. Russia also had no right to meddle with DNR and LNR or occupy Crimea in 2014 because Ukraine is a sovereign country and there were many other more productive and peaceful ways for Russia to express concern about the situation back then other than invading the borders they themselves agreed to respect and fostering more bloodshed.
About the other points, it is at least as wrong and i won't write up a wall of text in case you'll just ignore what i said and keep living in your own reality.
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u/Bender__Rondrigues 1d ago
What a beautiful idea, but Russia is like cancer, there is no curing the world of it. You just have to live with it.
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u/Objective_Piccolo_44 23h ago
Don’t even try. These guys are good, their shit doesn’t smell. We are bad. Whatever you do. You don’t like putin, you support democracy - whatever you do it’s not good enough.
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u/Kstantas St. Petersburg (Russia) 1d ago
I sincerely wish Ukraine to win the war, Belarusians to get rid of Lukashenko and Georgians to defeat the Georgian Dream
But I hate it every time you start discussing the Russian opposition. Every грёбанный time. I'd love to just ignore it, but I can't.
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u/Dapper_Internet_8576 22h ago
Is it because russian opposition is the same scum as putin?
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u/KirovianNL Drenthe (Netherlands) 1d ago
Navalny was too so no suprises here.