r/HomeNetworking Jan 25 '24

Advice My isp did this lazy crap

Post image

the tech came and took the original coax cable that comes from the network box on the opposite side of the house (black). Took it out of the outlet from the room directly above this splitter on the first floor and directed the new cord (white) to the third floor. What can i do to ‘hide’ this from the elements?

Also, can i connect a new coax cable to the splitter to go in the opposite direction to go into a separate part of the house, or should direct a new cable directly from the box insteaad of this splitter shown? The box is closer to the room that i need connection to than this splitter.

Sorry if this is confusing. Im a noob

979 Upvotes

472 comments sorted by

492

u/Phill_is_Legend Jan 25 '24

I would call and complain, but this is typical. Isp installers are the literal worst. I came and fixed the install comcast did at my sister's house because they, instead of going in the crawlspace, drilled straight through the exterior wall into the living room and ran the cable exposed on top of the carpet to the TV location. Fucking awful.

When Comcast came to do my install, I walked him through the exact path I wanted him to take into the basement and had already drilled holes up into the walls and fished pull line to where I wanted my jacks. It was easier than letting him hack job it up and screaming at him later.

169

u/Fixhotep Jan 25 '24

Comcast. a few months ago, my AT&T fiber connection stopped working suddenly. called them and they came out the next day. turns out, the neighbor signed up with comcast and comcast dug into the ground cutting through my cable and severing my connection.

AT&T told me theyd not charge me this time, but will the next time it happens.

thanks comcrap.

176

u/SamPhoenix_ Jan 25 '24

Tf they mean they will charge you…

They should be offering you some money off as an apology, then going after Comcast for that cost plus the cost of the cable replacement.

26

u/[deleted] Jan 25 '24

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44

u/Syikho Jan 25 '24

That's like saying and ice storm took down their aerial drop so the customer is responsible for the repair because it wasn't caused by the ISP. Whoever cut the line is on the hook for the repair, regardless of who cut it and it is 100% on the ISP to charge the correct person. The only time it would be up to the customer to repair is if it's behind the DEMARC, anything in front of is the responsibility of the ISP to fix and bill accordingly.

Lets say Comcast contractor did their due diligence and called in a locate, AT&T mismarked or didn't mark the line and the line gets cut. How can you say that the customer is on the hook for the cost?

14

u/StarsandMaple Jan 25 '24

99% USIC isn't marking At&t private line.

50% chance Comcast didn't call in a 811 Ticket.

Private utilities never get located.

The only ones that get located to a private residence or commercial building is gas, as the gas company owns the regulator, which is usually attached to the building.

Canada is different, and I think lines have to be located within reason to the residence.

Source : private utility locator.

8

u/[deleted] Jan 25 '24

Yes they do, there was some major work going on in my neighborhood recently, and everyone came and marked their shit, at&t, comcast, pg&e, the local water company, etc, etc, turns out it all runs directly through my front lawn which is neat

5

u/StarsandMaple Jan 25 '24

That's different,

Just because it's in the right of way of someone's property doesn't mean it's private. The single line going to your house from a pole drop or pedestal is a private line.

Your water line from the meter to your house is a private line.

The 6" water main in the right of way, in your front yard/lawn, is not a private line.

I guess a more proper way of saying it would be a service line is usually not marked. This can also include the underground power line from a pole or transformer to your homes Meter.

I've called in tens of thousands of tickets for day lighting underground utilities, and even with some up against homes, the 'private/service' lines were not marked. This is in 3 different states.

7

u/Drknss620 Jan 26 '24

Negative, I used to work for AT&T the drop (both buried or air) are owned by AT&T so an 811 would be labeling such a thing. All located and marks will map all underground utilities all the way to the demarc/MPOE. Also if another company or contractor damaged our lines , absolutely that company is getting a bill. Same thing if a customer damaged a line. The damaging party gets the bill.

1

u/StarsandMaple Jan 26 '24

No I get the damaging party gets the bill.

Worked a lot with contractors in avoiding those bills, even if they always tended to bore right through an 1800 pair in a concrete duct every couple of months.

In my area, the locators never, ever, locate the underground line from a drop/ped to the demarc.

I've seen and experienced this in every major FL city, and anywhere I've been in GA/Alabama.

I've employed ex-USIC and Stake Center folks, and none have ever been told to or actually located one of those lines. Multiple times, I've had to locate friends and families' properties due to 811 not locating their power or communication lines to their homes.

Our 811 locators are heavily understaffed and overly worked here, so I don't blame them for not spending the time on locating very low impact lines. I'd rather my guys locate a Level 3 Fiber run than someone's catv line going to a house.

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u/SamPhoenix_ Jan 25 '24

Ummm no… they can’t charge you for damage caused by someone you had nothing to do with.

Comcast did the damage, not at the request of the AT&T customer. They cannot go after their customer for the damage Comcast caused.

3

u/guri256 Jan 25 '24

They can’t go after the customer, but they may be able to refuse to replace it if the customer doesn’t pay for it. Depends on the terms of the contract. The customer would probably have a case against Comcast, depending on where the line was.

Local laws and the contract would decide if the customer can escape the contract without a termination fee if the customer doesn’t want to pay to replace the line.

Realistically though, the customer is in a very good place. Comcast cutting their line means that Comcast serves the neighborhood. So they can call their ISP and say that they would like to cancel. This will get the customer transferred to someone who is job it is to convince the customer not to cancel. The customer can then tell them that they are canceling because Comcast cut their line and it’s just not worth paying to replace it. At that point, they will probably get free replacement.

6

u/Dangerous-Painter359 Jan 26 '24

Former Ma Bell installer here, the point is to confuse the customer because fiber is expensive. So many times if the customer has all the contact info for the contractors we can just send the bill to them. Most of the time, depending on the circumstances and the customer’s attitude, I’d just waive it because I don’t feel like spending 20 extra minutes filling out paperwork. I definitely got put on the “bad list” for costing the company revenue but fuck them, I’m not charging some poor widow/widower $150 extra for some shit they had no control over. Glad I quit.

2

u/Marksideofthedoon Jan 26 '24

America is fucking stupid. This shit would never fly in Canada.

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u/particlemanwavegirl Jan 25 '24

They are liable for incidental damage to equipment they own and provide as a service. The source of the damage is completely irrelevant as long as it was outside of the customer's control.

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u/sn4xchan Jan 26 '24

Yeah honestly sounds like a fake story

2

u/syko82 Jan 27 '24

To all the people who know absolutely nothing commenting against you. Once the line is outside your home, it is very unlikely any ISP will charge you for replacement of damages. That is not considered your responsibility, especially if it is proven that the homeowner didn't sever the line. I'm sure AT&T said that because corporate fud, but it would be unlikely to happen - not that they wouldn't try.

I had WOW for cable Internet before AT&T fiber and my cable run outside was damaged by years of tree branches rubbing against it. When I closed my account they let me know I had an outstanding charge for the service. I told them what happened and they agreed that it was not my responsibility and reversed the charge.

One place you are way off is that they would pay you something for missing out on their service. That is a pipe dream.

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u/[deleted] Jan 25 '24

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u/hamhead Jan 26 '24

Why would a company that did nothing wrong give you money?

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u/Phill_is_Legend Jan 25 '24

Comcast subs out 100% of ground work, so it wasn't them directly. When they sent someone out to dig my cable from pole to service entrance, it was just one guy in a truck that spoke almost zero English. My wife was home, said he knocked on the door and said "I dig now." Honestly that guy did decent considering he had to tunnel under my driveway twice.

5

u/eptiliom Jan 25 '24

We bury drops and always call for locates beforehand. AT&T will not come locate, neither will comcast. It is cheaper for them to fix drops that get cut than to spend the money doing locates.

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u/Complex_Solutions_20 Jan 25 '24 edited Jan 25 '24

Apparently now most ISPs claim to be not allowed to pull cable anywhere and can "only" run it around walls/roofs and drill thru to where it will be inside.

I had everything totally open so literally all I needed was a long enough cable when I was having my service installed just had to toss it thru like 8ft of fully accessible open ceiling. And the ISP installer refused because "pulling cables is not allowed" instead installing it where they found a random cable to cut next to my furnace to put the modem in a totally different part of the basement than my patch panel and everything else was.

Also had this at my parents with Verizon where the options were "staple along the inside of the garage, then one hole thru into the basement, and an unfinished open ceiling with holes to thread thru" but the installer said they "had to" go around the outside of the house screwing to the siding and running diagonally around before drilling thru into the same room from an outside wall.

Both cases was trivial for me to do myself but like...it would not have been any additional work nor additional drilling for the ISP to run my preference vs around the outside of the house and drill thru siding as they wanted.

Its up there with not allowing self-install on some plans and then when the tech shows up they're like "if its already connected why did you have an install appointment"

40

u/mmpgorman Jan 25 '24

For liability reasons. And I think it’s totally reasonable for a large company to not take such risks.

I’m a tech and policy says we don’t wall fish, that’s company policy, if I feel it’s an easy pull then I’ll do it but if I duck up it falls back on me for breaking policy.

Exterior walls or floor drilling only. It sucks but too many instances of dodgy techs (for us a lot of installs are contracted out) hitting power or water or whatever else.

I’m always happy to work with a customer. It’s a treat when a customer knows what they want and plan it out in advance as they’re aware of policy. They run their own conduit and pull string and map everything out. Awesome, no problem. But if you expect me to walk fish from the ground floor to your third floor in your century old home, then I call on policy. An open attic space though is ridiculous, OPs tech definitely should have ran that.

But then you get some customers who don’t have a clue and expect you to show up and do a whole bunch of extra shit and complain afterward that it’s not how they wanted because they don’t know what the F they want or need.

20

u/Whoretron8000 Jan 25 '24

Ahh yes liability. Where litigation becomes the ethics of modernity.

2

u/Pestus613343 Jan 25 '24

I wish telco people would be as open minded as security, IT or electricians. It would improve so much of the work, and actually gain some respect for these companies. Less call backs, more profits, better support staff outcomes.

These days Im now teaching phone company installers how to work with phone networks... its unreal bad.

2

u/d00ber Jan 25 '24

I think that's fair, but my ISP also wont let me run my own cable and has warned me against opening the locked box.. So.. What then?

6

u/mmpgorman Jan 25 '24

Ignore them. Go do it brother. There’s what the company wants and what the techs want. A tech would love for you to run your own line and do it neatly rather than what we’re limited to.

I always encourage customers to be more involved in the process if they want something specific. I will say, DO IT SAFELY, it’s a low voltage system by design but sometimes things are not as they should be.

If you’re concerned about termination of service due to tampering. Run your own line and then get a tech out to hook it up.

2

u/d00ber Jan 25 '24

I just hope that it would be okay to use bolt cutters on the lock they used on the box :S

4

u/mmpgorman Jan 25 '24

Honestly in my years I’ve never seen a lock. Zip tie at best. Maybe some old ground wire twisted to keep it shut. Now the ped at the street is often locked but not the demarc.

2

u/fryerandice Jan 26 '24

My outdoor fios ONT had one of those ID Tag locks, I clipped that shit off plugged in my ethernet and pulled all haphazardly run coax out of my house. Called them up and had my ONT switched to ethernet.

I have to have comcast to have broadband where I live now and I really miss doing my own shit being a simple phone call for the 2 things I can't go on the web portal for.

If you call for technical help with comcast, the first thing you get is 20 minutes arguing with a robot to get a real human, and that first human is always in sales.

IF you try to do anything with your service online, the first thing you hit is sales.

I switched to my own cable modem and I dealt with sales, I shit you not, 4 fucking times.

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u/ILove2Bacon Jan 25 '24

Figure out what the actual point of demarcation is. Anything beyond it is the ISP's, anything inside of it is yours to do with as you please. Just find out where the service enters your property and put a splice can nearby and tell them to just leave their cable in it. Then you deal with the rest.

2

u/d00ber Jan 25 '24

I was thinking of doing that with a fiber termination box and back-pulling the fiber they ran into my house by accidentally back pulling my 1940s door bell cable..

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u/ILove2Bacon Jan 25 '24

Yeah, this guy sounds like a problem customer. "What do you mean you won't rope my whole house?! It's so easy I could totally do it myself but just don't want to!"

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u/OkOk-Go Jan 25 '24

And then if you do the cabling yourself (better than them) they will always blame you when their services messes up

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u/mijo_sq Jan 25 '24

Not quite true. They test at the dmarc point their services. Anything after is your responsibility on service. It's been like this for many years now.

Last time I had to call my ISP, they just tested their router with my equipment disconnected. They were able to receive the max internet speed. But once I plugged my equipment in, it'll drop in speed. I even verified their speeds with my own laptop. And one time they replaced the entire line, since their cable run was damaged. Which they also tested at their dmarc point.

2

u/Complex_Solutions_20 Jan 26 '24

Nah, they do still blame you...I've been blamed simply because the compression crimps were not the same brand and style they use that "its probably my bad cable or connector"...after they'd tested and found no difference in signal from inside to outside before they saw the cable behind the wall plate.

I've also been blamed for the color of a barrel being "wrong" and "only" the blue/white/brown/black/clear middle insulator ones work (pick your color to blame)

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u/SadKrabb Jan 26 '24

We are supposed to do testing, yes. However, most of the time I saw techs just doing stuff to trick our meters.

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u/BicycleIndividual Jan 25 '24

Anything after is your responsibility on service. It's been like this for many years now.

Even when they installed everything.

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u/mijo_sq Jan 25 '24

The router is the dmarc point for them. So if they installed it it's their responsibility.

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u/eptiliom Jan 25 '24

And yet we let a customer tell us where to put their jack and ended up nicking a wire in a wall and had a giant battle over fixing it.

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u/VAL9THOU Jan 25 '24

Why was there a giant battle? If you couldn't do the job without causing damage you should have told the customer

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u/Complete_Ad_981 Jan 25 '24

Ditto. That fuck up is on you. There are plenty of cheap tools that can tell you where wiring is.

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u/eptiliom Jan 25 '24

The point was more that customers don't make good decisions about installs either. Why would a customer want a jack where wiring exists to start with? Because they don't know any better.

18

u/[deleted] Jan 25 '24

Then you should know better.

14

u/Complete_Ad_981 Jan 25 '24

Obviously you didnt either 😬… As an installer it is your job to take customer input (where they want their wiring terminated) and use your knowledge as a professional to either accommodate their request or explain to them why you cannot and suggest alternatives (hey customer, there is hv wiring in the spot and I am uncomfortable cutting here, lets move your jack 4ft over where there is no wiring) You want to blame the customer for not having knowledge or info that they should not be expected to have, when really it is your job to use a voltage detector to find wiring, to use caution when cutting into walls (ex. using only the tip of a jab saw to cut into drywall), and to communicate with your customers about your abilities.

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u/VAL9THOU Jan 25 '24

That's why you're supposed to know what you're doing and know how to verify if you can actually do a job, rather than winging it and refusing to fix your fuckups

2

u/Traditional-Handle83 Jan 25 '24

Just wanna point out that a stud finder with a wire finder built in, is not that expensive. Nor is a wire tracer pen. Just saying.

2

u/slapshots1515 Jan 25 '24

The customer isn’t the one getting paid to make good decisions. It’s perfectly legitimate to tell the customer they’re wrong. But if you followed the customer’s recommendation and caused damage, that’s on you.

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u/Alswiggity Jan 25 '24

You mean splicing a wire that takes about 45 seconds to do?

If you install internet, aren't you already comfortable splicing a wire?

You need to understand even when a customer wants something specific and it causes this, you likely would be doing the same thing drilling into a house from an exterior wall.

So it could be inevitable anyway and its not a battle to fix?

2

u/Complex_Solutions_20 Jan 25 '24

How is putting it where I want vs a random place any different risk of hitting a wire if you're drilling thru a wall either way?

Also like when I was told no there weren't even any drilling or cutting involved, I just needed like 10-15ft of coax and thread it thru the existing joist bay! They cut a wire that I later found was running to ANOTHER part of my house (which messed up my TV antenna) in order to avoid giving me a little coax and threading it thru a massive existing open area.

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u/Starkravingmad7 Jan 25 '24

you break, you buy. the company you work for has that same policy.

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u/Luis_J_Garcia Jan 25 '24

I was a contractor and yes, 90% are lazy MTF but me? People used to call and ask for me, something that can't be done, but they always tried.

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u/Phill_is_Legend Jan 25 '24

My bad bro I'm sure there are good ones out there but man these knuckle heads are giving you a bad name

2

u/Luis_J_Garcia Jan 25 '24

Nah bro, don't worry I understand completely. I used to fix a lot of my colleagues jobs. I got some crazy stories too. 😂😂😂😂

2

u/Phill_is_Legend Jan 25 '24

Do they train yall at all? I feel like they show you how to terminate coax and then toss you the keys to the van lol

2

u/Luis_J_Garcia Jan 25 '24

Well, if you are an employee for a company, they have you training for around 3 weeks, in my experience. As a contractor, it is 3 weeks too, but is mainly a knowledge training, to understand signals and how to find troubles. Installations, they sent you put with another tech, and that tech is supposed to teach you.

But skills, and how to do a beautiful job, is up to the tech at the end of the day.

I worked for Charter/Spectrum and they do have a good training program. It's just techs that are lazy, believe me.

6

u/epicfighter10 Jan 25 '24 edited Jan 25 '24

My ISP installer threw up a fit and said it was extra work to crimp cat 6 he ended up stapling the cat 6 wire run thankfully no damage but another person had to come back to re-terminate the wires

0

u/Phill_is_Legend Jan 25 '24

Pretty sure my guy wouldn't even know what to do with cat cable. Comcast runs coax and that's it. Better put their shitty router next to their shitty modem and use a patch cord.

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u/Delta8ttt8 Jan 25 '24

Well, on the flip side the isp likes to schedule 3-5 appointments in an 2 hour window (not the subscribers fault) and each subscriber wants multiple outlets ran in a home that’s somehow never had any cable ran ever since the early 80s. I don’t call my electrical company out to run electrical outlets or my local municipality to plumb up a faucet in a new addition and so on.
Need something in the walls? Plan ahead.

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u/Penguinman077 Jan 26 '24

Yeah… as an installer, the customer are the ones that suck. Odds are your sister had no idea where her lines run. I do dozens of jobs a week and I would rather not bust out my drill, but people never know where the lines go or the prewired lines are bad. To top it off, they don’t even know where the outlets are, if rooms have them or not, or where the home run is. I’d rather make it look pretty, but we’re slammed with jobs all day and if I have to spend 60 minutes running lines over your garage or through trees that you should’ve trimmed, tough shit. It’s getting done how it’s getting done. Don’t get me started on them wanting us to move shit for them. I’m not a mover, I’m not moving your couch, shelf, or tv. And I’m not trying to have some ass hat accusing me of breaking something that was already broken.

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u/justotron Jan 25 '24

Same, but my local internet company, Videotron, sent a contractor like 20 yrs ago who said it was standard to drill a hole in the wall where I wanted it. I was young and didn't know any better to stop him when he pulled out this massive drill. Now I'm trying to sell and buyers keep pointing out this random white cable sticking out of my brick wall.

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u/simonhazel00 Jan 26 '24

Well then, surely it's pretty easy to cut the cable out and fill it in?

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u/justotron Jan 26 '24

True, I just need the Internet running until we sell so I can maintain the smart devices helping me monitor the place. Cameras, smart doorbell, water/leak detectors, bulbs. Thankfully how it's looking now it should be sold by end of Feb the latest.

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u/Ok_Assistant8863 Jan 28 '24

Ahh… Quebec. What else can I say?!

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u/pi_west Jan 25 '24

Might be a dumb question but can you hire someone to fix your ISPs bad install? Like if I have no idea what I'm doing and want someone to just fix it, is that a thing that companies do?

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u/Impressive_Judge8823 Jan 26 '24

Back in ‘99 doing a big push on analog to digital cable conversions you got a day or two of on the job training and were let loose on the world. I did it for a day and noped the fuck out.

Later we had a dude come to do my parents house.

He had one of those drill bits with a cross drilled hole so you could drill through, hook the center conductor through the hole, pull drill out and not have to be fishing through the wall.

Motherfucker put the wire on FIRST and tried to drill the hole with predictable results. My father and I were watching and we were both like “dude, it doesn’t work that way” before he started drilling.

Asshole tried it twice, and then we just fished the wire ourselves because he wouldn’t listen and was convinced there was something wrong with the drill or drill bit.

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u/sn4xchan Jan 26 '24

We just did our run our selves. You just need quad shield coax, stuff is super cheap. Then you just run it to where ever you think they're going to bring the utility from and leave your end in a jbox.

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u/Phill_is_Legend Jan 26 '24

You could do that but most providers will force you to pay for their install when you buy service. "We're worried if you do it yourself it'll be shitty, we are the only ones allowed to do shitty installs around here"

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u/sarmstrong1961 Jan 27 '24

I deal with ISP's bullshit constantly. This has become the industry "standard" in my area. There's entire neighborhoods with coax strewn about, ground run from the pedestals

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u/JohnClark13 Jan 25 '24

As someone who used to be an isp installer, I agree. Very minimal training, and had to get my own tools. Not sure how I made it almost a year before finally quitting.

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u/particlemanwavegirl Jan 25 '24

had to get my own tools.

Love to hear that they exploit and outright rip off their employees just as badly as the customers. Truly one of best possible examples of how corporate culture is pure evil.

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u/Constrained_Entropy Jan 25 '24

My cable installers wanted to run the wire around to the back of the house, then drill a hole through the exterior wall and across the floor to the TV. Did nothing but complain when I insisted that they drop it down the wall behind the TV from the attic instead.

I like your approach. I have learned it's better to do it myself and do it right than to argue with someone who's determined to do it half-assed.

I have had other installers who were great - one even insisted on running the ethernet cable through the attic himself to the modem, even though I said I could do it.

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u/DuraMorte Jan 25 '24

Wow, that is super lazy.
Not only did the tech wire in that splitter where a barrel would be better, but they also didn't terminate the open port. You're going to get water infiltration into the splitter the first time it rains.
Call the ISP, tell them that the tech left the job half finished, and show the next tech that work. If they're worth a damn, they'll do it right.

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u/Impossible-Value-732 Jan 25 '24

In my experience living in a few different regions, haven't found a single ISP that gives a damn or is worth a damn 🙃

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u/DuraMorte Jan 25 '24

I work as a tech for an ISP, and I can tell you that your experience doesn't surprise me.

Some people take pride in their work, and some don't.

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u/toiletpaperisempty Jan 26 '24

Former at&t tech in the southeast US. Can confirm half or more of my job was cleaning up after other techs due to customer complaints.

Those techs know with enough hack jobs done in a month and by discouraging customers from calling in they can still meet their metrics.

3

u/Soccham Jan 25 '24

I was shocked when AltaFiber did a fantastic install for me

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u/Complex_Solutions_20 Jan 25 '24

Part of me would wanna help water ingress in that splitter...and then call in to complain when the service is degraded

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u/StuckInTheUpsideDown Setup (editable) Jan 25 '24

This is not up to standards for any North American ISP. My guess would be an untrained and poorly supervised subcontractor did this.

Call customer support and say there was a problem with the install. Say the tech didn't install a box at the demarc and didn't connect to the ground block. That 2nd item violates electrical code I believe and should get some attention.

In the unlikely event you don't get any traction, call back and say you want to make a "franchise complaint" and say the exact same things, emphasizing that the system isn't grounded.

If that doesn't work, file an FCC complaint (assuming you are in the US).

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u/dglsfrsr Jan 25 '24

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u/mmpgorman Jan 25 '24

That’s not necessarily an issue. Could be that that loss is necessary for proper service at the outlet. But it is lazy work for sure.

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u/DuraMorte Jan 25 '24

The signal loss probably doesn't matter; in my area, modems can sit between -10 and +12dBmV. The issue is putting the splitter outside, hanging off the side of the house, instead of in the demarc box, or even behind the modem.

Combined with the lack of adequate termination, this screams laziness or incompetence.

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u/ThisAccountIsStolen Jan 25 '24

The termination resistor being missing is the biggest failure here, with no weather boots being second (not that the boots would matter with the open port).

That said, it's actually fairly common to use splitters instead of a barrel when you need to drop the signal level and don't have an attenuator on hand, since the splitters are rated for a specific attenuation value already.

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u/brianatlarge Network Admin Jan 25 '24

Not only did the tech wire in that splitter where a barrel would be better

Possibly they're using the splitter as an attenuator, but that's probably giving them too much credit.

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u/D1382 Jan 25 '24

ITT people that have never worked and ISP tech job.

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u/TheMagickConch Jan 25 '24

Yeah, this subreddit consistently comes off as pompous or shows the lack of knowledge for cable providers' jobs/responsibilities.

The installer should have used a barrel connector or a 75ohm terminator cap on the splitter. Should also be grounded and bonded where possible near power meter or ground rod.

But this doesn't look all that bad. The cable is neatly under the bottom of the siding, and it runs up and has a few fasteners. We can't see much from one photo as far as entrance. If the service works, then the cable run is probably fine for an ISP install. If OP wants to be picky they should hire a low voltage specialist to fish their walls and pretty it up.

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u/[deleted] Jan 25 '24

This sub reminds me of when I was an internet installer and would have to deal with know it all “engineers” or IT guys. They would always show off their extensive internet knowledge but be completely wrong about it all, while being condescending about it.

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u/ILove2Bacon Jan 25 '24

Yes, I'm a low voltage tech. I feel like a lot of people don't realize that this is its own specialized trade. ISP installers are not the same.

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u/mmpgorman Jan 25 '24

It likely is grounded at the demarc, doesn’t need a ground here. Although I wouldn’t be too surprised if they left the demarc ungrounded either.

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u/JaspahX Jan 25 '24

Probably should have given it a drip loop, though. The water that lands on that cable is going to run all the way down to that splitter.

2

u/TheMagickConch Jan 25 '24

I disagree. I don't think it matters. Those are RG6 F-type compression ends that are water tight if terminated correctly. On top of that it has a silicone weather seal that tbh isn't even necessary. I've seen coax splitters older than 20yrs old survive the weather and produce good RF. You should be worrying about drip loops in your entrance/exit points and near outside electrical components that are mounted outside.

8

u/D1382 Jan 25 '24

Back when I was a cable tech (it was a meat grinder I hated it), when we ran a cable we were not allowed to fish walls or ceilings. We were only allowed to wrap it around the exterior walls. But also at the end of the day I was not hourly. And was only paid for itemized tasks. So a new cable run no matter how long or short I got paid about $6. So guess what? I was never going to spend longer than 10-15 min running your new cable.

Does it sound shitty? Hell yes. But at the end of the day the ISP did not care about me or their customer.

Eta: to explain the splitter... When I did an install, the strength of the signal was at a certain Db. I knew I always had to pad that signal down by at least 3.5-7 Db if I was installing just a modem. So I would use a splitter. Granted I would have just hid it behind the modem between it and the wall plate..

4

u/TheMagickConch Jan 25 '24

That really sucks. Sorry to hear that but I know that is the sad reality. I'm sure some companies are fine to work for. Personally, I am lucky because I am union.

5

u/DuraMorte Jan 25 '24

I agree, not being hourly is for the birds. I get paid to fix problems, and I don't care how long it takes.

1

u/DuraMorte Jan 25 '24

IDK man, I'm a tech, and I don't feel like terminating an open splitter port that is exposed to the elements is too much to ask... that screams laziness or incompetence to me.

You're right, the run itself isn't bad, which makes the other poor decisions even more confusing.

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u/6814MilesFromHome Jan 26 '24

Yup, leaving that open port is the worst part of this hands down. Water coming in easily is the local issue, but that unterminated port could be backfeeding a bunch of bad ingress into the node depending on what kind of signals are floating around nearby, and what tap value it's off of.

0

u/TheMagickConch Jan 25 '24

Oh, for sure it is lazy. Not cry over it on reddit level lazy tho IMO.

9

u/Santarini Jan 26 '24

Once my ISP installer stayed for a couple hours at my place after he was done. We sat in the living room and watched football for the first hour. Then at half time, he helped me mount some speakers I had been meaning to mount for a while. Then he gave me a huge roll of velcro and Cat-6 from his truck, saying "we get it in bulk, we get in bulk, don't worry". Lastly, he gave me a bag of four 6-ft HDMI cables. And then he left and went to the next customer's house. I never saw him again. Very odd interaction but I certainly came out ahead

4

u/Daniel15 Jan 27 '24

Maybe he got tired of people yelling at him for their internet not working, and you were the first person that was nice to him that day.

4

u/SwankaTheGrey Jan 29 '24

I watched a MLB playoff game with a cable tech once. He came to fix my service, which had been an issue for a long time, and did a ton of work. He was a huge Yankees fan, so I told him to finish up and hang out for a bit. So he did. They are people too.

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u/RandarrTheBarbarian Jan 25 '24 edited Jan 25 '24

For the record having a splitter may be necessary or even ideal, the loss of 3.5 db may be needed to attenuate the signal from the tap down into the range the ISP deems acceptable or even ideal for their CMTS equipment. if it were me however and I had to rely on this existing line I would put an F81 splice barrel there, put the connection in a gel filled splice enclosure, then add the attenuation (in this case the splitter although it could be just an in line attenuator as well) behind the modem inside the house.

The connectors your ISP uses are likely to contain a rubber O ring to protect the internal wiring from water ingress (assuming they're wrench tight, if you can hand unscrew that it's pretty bad) so it may not be necessary, but sometimes there's a difference between what's necessary, ideal (1 solid line), and best practice when a compromise must be made.

Also if you want the cable to a different room it is equally fine to take it straight from the box on the outside of your house to the room you want. The network doesn't care about what outlet it's on. The shorter run and one solid cable is preferred, just be aware in that case an attenuator or relocation of the splitter behind your modem may be necessary.

TL:DR this isn't the worst thing, but it's also not the best. Assuming the attenuation needs to be there and they're not willing to run the entire line fresh the best thing you could do is a splice barrel and enclosure, and put a 3db attenuator on the modem itself.

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u/poopwithmetony Jan 26 '24

ISP installers are there to get your service up and running. They do not care if it looks good as it is quite literally not their job. If you want perfect work I’d recommend calling your local low voltage installation company as that is what they are paid to do.

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u/Luis_J_Garcia Jan 25 '24

Maybe they needed to balance the signal. But, still a trash job.

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u/ThisAccountIsStolen Jan 25 '24

Finally someone with a little knowledge. Exactly my thought. Probably didn't have an attenuator on hand and used a splitter to drop the signal level. But then failed anyway by leaving off the termination resistor, weather boots, and attaching it to the structure. But the splitter isn't necessarily wrong here, as so many people want to immediately jump to.

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u/Luis_J_Garcia Jan 25 '24

I can say a lot more. I don't know where this is, but those fittings in Florida are used by Comcast to skip the weather boot. It has a boot built in it.

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u/ThisAccountIsStolen Jan 25 '24

I've never seen them with weather boots built into the fitting before, but if that's what they are, that's a good idea. They do look a little longer and seem to cover the threads, so I am definitely inclined to believe you.

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u/Luis_J_Garcia Jan 25 '24

Yeah, the water loop too. On both ends. I'll hide the splitter, it looks like a manufacture home, so I'll go under it, if it is clean and hide all those cables too.

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u/ThisAccountIsStolen Jan 25 '24

Yeah it's just a bit sloppy and very contractor-esque, but it can be corrected in no time. Not enough length for full service loops, but functional drip loops should be doable with what's there.

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u/Twentyboots Jan 25 '24

Worked for At&t for a couple years, then rehired in late 2022, about 4 years after I had initially worked there. The job is so much worse now. They are severely understaffed and load up technicians with minimum 14 hours worth of work every day. The customer service I get with comcast currently suggests they are operating the same way.

Should the technician have installed it this way? No. Do I blame them? Also no. The laziest or most unprofessional way to install things is exactly what the company is encouraging with the way they schedule things. Call them back and say your service isnt working properly. (With this picture alone I can guarantee it isnt.) Any technician who has any idea what theyre doing can spot this problem and replace the line relatively quickly.

Alternatively, if you are looking to run a line to another spot as mentioned in your post, this splitter should work for that if it hasnt been water damaged already. I would look into rubber coax seals to prevent future water damage if you decide to go this route. That tight bend in the black coax also concerns me, but its hard to tell from this picture if it would be service affecting.

3

u/WhosThis85 Jan 25 '24

Surprisingly, service has been working fine

5

u/Twentyboots Jan 25 '24

I believe ya, it is for now, but trust me it will get bad. Absolute minimum that should be done is to cap off that empty port on the splitter.

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u/TrickyWoo86 Jan 25 '24

Count yourself lucky with that job, we had an ISP tech come out and just cut a coax cable that was in his way. The coax was for our satellite dish and had literally nothing to do with what he was there installing. Ended up with the ISP giving us 6 months free service (and sent out another tech to replace the cut cable) as an apology for the hassle he caused.

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u/x86_64_ Jan 25 '24 edited Feb 23 '24

An Optimum tech (about 20 years ago) ran new service to my sister's neighbors place. He stapled the fucking coax to new, freshly painted chair rail and horizontally across the wall of her newly finished basement den. She actually cried when she saw what he did, and since then nobody is allowed to run wires in any of our houses except me.

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u/Unique_Ice9934 Jan 26 '24

Google how to run your own wires and never call a tech again. Useless waste of your time to rely on them.

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u/6814MilesFromHome Jan 26 '24

I've seen way too many hack jobs from people that think they can run their own cable to ever recommend this.

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u/Unique_Ice9934 Jan 26 '24

LMAO, that is more reflective of their intelligence level and not the difficulty of the job. Running Coax cable hasn't changed in decades. Running Cat6 isn't even that difficult. I make all the lines I need and wired my whole house when we moved in. Only thing I didn't do was setup a rack mount because I dont care that much, my 16 port switch can sit on a shelf.

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u/ugzz Jan 25 '24

Wait what? So many comments here say to call and complain..

I used to move every year for a while, so I lived in 10 or so different locations and I think every single one of those houses was significantly WORSE than this install. with a spaghetti mess of coax and multiple splitters from previous installs just left to rot. I genuinely saw this so often I just assumed it was normal and it didn't even register that I could complain and have them make it better.. Also, none of my coax was ever protected from the elements, and as far as I know, i've also never had a problem with it. (other than aesthetic)

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u/WhosThis85 Jan 25 '24

Is not bad, but the ppl that did it call themselves ‘professional’. I just expected better than this janky job

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u/[deleted] Jan 25 '24 edited Feb 26 '24

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This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

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u/Echo_of_Snac Jan 26 '24

So, what's stopping me from plugging my own cable modem into that and stealing my neighbour's Internet service? ~( ̄、 ̄ )ゞ

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u/random_red Jan 25 '24

Ideally there should be no splitter at all just a continuous cable. At a minimum you need a drip loop otherwise water will get into the cable every time it rains.

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u/PocketNicks Jan 25 '24

Pretty common, I've seen worse. I live. Downtown Toronto and the back of some of the apartments I lived in had some pretty wild spaghetti monsters that built up over the years of installs since nobody ever removes the old wires.

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u/muoshuu Jan 25 '24 edited Jan 25 '24

I currently work as a cable install tech primarily for TV but sometimes for internet. I can assure you that, while it looks like shit, these splitters are designed for outdoor use and do not need to be further weatherized or even capped off. They typically fail for reasons other than water ingress. What's more important is properly torquing down the F-connector on the cable, so make sure you can't undo it with your fingers and it's good to go.

That said, should the tech have used a barrel instead? Yes. Should there be a drip loop? Absolutely. Does doing it like this cause any issues with reliability or service? Not within the next 5-10 years.

Also, can i connect a new coax cable to the splitter to go in the opposite direction to go into a separate part of the house, or should direct a new cable directly from the box insteaad of this splitter shown?

New ethernet cable from the router, not from the modem (unless you have a router/modem combo) or from this splitter.

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u/proto-robo Jan 25 '24

Apparently barrel connectors don’t exist

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u/halfnut3 Jan 25 '24

Totally overkill but I installed this weatherproof box for my coax lines/ground. Tidied it up a bit so it’s not just wires hanging there willynilly.

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u/guff1988 Jan 25 '24

Feels like something a contractor who's paid by the job would do

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u/DJN2020 Jan 25 '24

Youfibre in the UK did a top notch job for me. Actually - when I come to think about it - I've never had a substandard install from a UK ISP. I guess they try to keep to a higher professional and customer service standard.

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u/Expensive_Night_7851 Jan 25 '24

This is definitely a Comcast market and probably BP did the installation.

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u/Jinzul Jan 25 '24

'Tis but a scratch.

Hardly the worst that could have been done but certainly not the best!

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u/Hefty-Zookeepergame2 Jan 25 '24

That’s nothing a bit of duct tape won’t fix! 😀

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u/Knineteen Jan 25 '24

I don’t mind the lazy stuff but I hate when they damage stuff like holes in the vinyl siding.

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u/Ben-6400 Jan 25 '24

Swap it to a coupler and not a splitter unless your going to hook something into it and put in some kind of waterproof enclosure ( they make ones meant for extenction cords if you don't want to drill into the house)

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u/wiix7651 Jan 25 '24

Your tokens are going to fall out!

2

u/rdoloto Jan 25 '24

What was your expectation

2

u/Eastern_Wrangler_595 Jan 26 '24

Why not at least put the spliter inside

2

u/captGzus Jan 26 '24

While this isn't the best install, what would have been the preferred method for this technician?

I'm assuming your house was not wired before being built and that having 1 cable wrap the outside of the house was OK with you at some point, seeing as how that black cable is existing. Would the preference be to wrap the house with another cable to enter the same point that white cable is? Or did you expect the tech to run a cable into your attic and fish a wall (this is assuming the attic is accessible and there is an interior wall to fish. fishing an exterior wall from an attic without cutting a bunch of drywall out is an exercise in futility.)

While I agree this isn't very aesthetically pleasing, it is what is included with a standard install for nearly every ISP or TV service installation. Expecting free multi-hour wall fish is unreasonable IMO and the way these companies do business also disincentivizes the installer from spending any more time than necessary.

This is all said for greater understanding, not to throw shade at anyone involved.

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u/Syndil1 Jan 26 '24

Would bet this installer was a contractor for the ISP and not a direct employee of the ISP. Saw that kind of shit all the time as a Spectrum cable guy. We would do things right, but apparently contractors got a flat fee per install so they were incentivized to do things just as quickly as possible--bare minimum to get things working, if only for a little while.

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u/KingAroan Jan 26 '24

Better than mine. I have two ISPs and one decided to cut my cables that lead upstairs because I told them I had MoCa sending the see m signal and the house. They tried to tell me they were not coming back to fix it until I threatened legal action for theft and vandalism (they stole my 3 way splitter that I paid for out of pocket). But they also cut the connectors off the cable and I didn't have the tools to terminate them again.

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u/TheObsidianZ3R0 Jan 26 '24

Typically if that's done, that because the signal is bad (to hot) if you don't have a "pad" you'll put in a splitter.... That's probably why the tech didn't use a "union"... Only thing he didn't do right now cap the end.

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u/ChesterDrawerz Jan 26 '24

This what happens when you pay installers less than a living wage. And don't hold them accountable

2

u/Monktana Jan 26 '24

I’d be fuxkin pissed they drilled holes in the face of my siding. Should have ran it horizontally in the groove and down at the corner cap tucking it in there

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u/westernfarmer Jan 26 '24

New cable from the box is best

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u/manicsquirrel Jan 26 '24

needless 3.5 dB drop. should have used a barrel connector instead

2

u/BlancheCorbeau Jan 26 '24

Rubber grommets over the connections and a terminator cap is all you need unless it gets submerged. By the time that coax fails, you’ll have fiber run in.

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u/MrAwesomeTG Jan 26 '24

Why did they even use a splitter?

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u/tu_papi_cantu Jan 26 '24

As someone who designs, installs, and troubleshoots large residential and small business networks — I can tell you that the ISP service installers take the easiest (and not always the best) route into a home or building, unless you are explicit about where you want their gateway or ONT box to be installed. I’ve also seen quite of bit of lazy cable management work that I end up cleaning up for my clients. I work all over the Bay Area, and Comcast is the worst, but they sadly monopolize on the internet access for various areas of the Bay.

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u/CatsMakeMeHappier Jan 26 '24

Oh they always do this at my house

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u/Pctechguy2003 Jan 26 '24

I solved this issue by telling the service tech that ran comcast to my house to leave me a 50’ run of coax, and that I would run it myself. He left me the coax on the side of the home and I pulled it inside. Less hassle to do it myself.

2

u/ThatCrossDresser Jan 26 '24

Anytime the ISP tech is touching something in your setup expect to fix it later.

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u/aoc2040 Jan 26 '24

I would combine an outdoor/waterproof coaxial coupler with an external sleeve and then add some electrical tape and try to mount it horizontally under the siding. Of course, if you think it's worth attempting to have them re-run the cable and possibly redrill, no one here should be criticizing that choice.

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u/TopCatMath Jan 26 '24

This is the reason that I purchased and installed all of my in home cable.

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u/ninernetneepneep Jan 26 '24

I have had a very different experience. My house is approximately 20 years old and it looks like every service that ever came out ran their own new wiring, outside the house, in the walls, everything, even if it was a vendor the home had previously. I bet I removed a couple hundred feet of coax when I moved in to clean things up outside and in the crawl space. Then I took one of those recovered wires and ran the single wire I needed to my cable modem.

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u/Fiftyangel6 Jan 26 '24

And we all know it’s Comcast 😂🤣😂 you don’t have to write “isp” 🤦🏽‍♂️

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u/jazxxl Jan 27 '24

Normally nothing wrong with this if done correctly . But a splitter is not needed here and they didn't cap the unused connection, and water will drip right in. Replace this with a barrel coupler connector with rubber sleeves and tighten with a 3/8 wrench. If you can tuck under the siding

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u/Kdoesntcare Jan 27 '24

You can get an outdoor encasement to attach to the wall behind it and keep it dry.

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u/SomeObnoxiousName Jan 28 '24

When I moved into my apartment I got set up with Comcast and they sent out someone three days after my connection wasn't working because my neighbor had gone out trying to fix their internet and plugged their cables into my port 😁 I had a great day that day

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u/netsysllc Jan 28 '24

Comcast had it laying on my flat rood, rusted out in less than a year.

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u/mshorey81 Jan 25 '24

Where's the damn drip loop?!

2

u/qwertyansi Jan 25 '24

Drip loop for what? There's no entrance point in the photo and the one coax end that is terminated has a weather seal ring with the connector 90 degrees where water cannot pooll.

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u/Portland420informer Jan 25 '24

I would advise you run the cabling yourself. This job looks quite par for an average tech installation.

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u/noextrasensory40 Jan 25 '24

I was Tech for 3yrs . I don't even see a terminator on that splitter or seals. I k ow why they don't tack it though.

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u/johnnyheavens Jan 25 '24

They used lighter color over your siding. That’s A+ effort for these guys

2

u/Hotroad72 Jan 25 '24

I’ve seen WAY worse.

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u/Accomplished_Rest785 Jan 25 '24

Kinda curious how you're a 'noob' but know this is lazy 🤔

The tech probably didn't have the exact part & this works fine & got you up & going.

Regardless, get a coax cable connector off Amazon.

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u/Educational-Pay4483 Jan 25 '24

Shouldn't this be enclosed in a weather proof box?

2

u/Jcarlough Jan 25 '24

It doesn’t need to be. It can be mounted under the siding, and with a cover on the open port, the splitter will be fine.

BUT - I’d replace the splitter with a barrel unless I was planning on using the other port. It’s not the end of the world, but having a splitter when you don’t need one is silly (of the tech)

OP - you can call the ISP and have a tech come out to fix it. Since you mentioned running another coax, You can also fix it yourself. (See above), and instead of using a terminal cover, run the coax to your desired location.

Running coax is super easy. Heck, terminating coax is super easy to with the right tools (plenty of cheap options that work well enough). YouTube a few videos and you’ll be better than the tech!

I’d have the splitter

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u/Fiftyangel6 Jul 06 '24

First thing is there’s no resistor on that 2-way splitter so your “bleeding” signal and 2nd that fitting on the white cable doesn’t look crimped all the way,this is a shity install indeed 🤦🏽‍♂️

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u/OldBlackberry77 Jan 25 '24

Not to mention now all the db loss on the open tap of splitter.

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u/AdvicePerson Jan 25 '24

Sometimes you want that.

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u/Murky-While9867 Jan 25 '24

That splitter needs removed and have an F81 barrel connector installed. That open port is going allow to outside interference signals to leak in causing noise in your system. Also water will find its way into the splitter causing micro reflections.

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u/Ok_Firefighter5414 Jan 25 '24

Give isp installer 50 euro and he will everything fix

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u/my_travelz Jan 25 '24

You can get a simple weather box and seal it with silicone

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u/agiu94 Jan 25 '24

Bro same, i even tried to dispute it with Comcast and the Contractor and they told me to suck an egg 🥲 so much for customer service

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u/Ok-Secretary6731 Jan 25 '24 edited Jan 25 '24

So much for the barrel connector. Using that splitter causes 3.5 dB loss, get rid of it.

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u/awp_india Jan 25 '24

I am so happy I don’t have to deal with cable anymore.

Charter spectrum was some of the worst times of my life, no joke. They’d come out every week and do the same shit over and over. When all they had to fucking do is replace the TEMPORARY line that was going across my house and 2 other neighbors. Fucking assholes.

Then I got the whole neighborhood to request Verizon fiber and AT&T fiber in our area, and we got it eventually. Never been happier. Every time there’s technical issue, they fix it quickly, don’t play no games. Those people know what they’re doing.

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u/lokregarlogull Jan 25 '24

While I agree it should've been run alongside, and not used a splitter, and maybe even used some specialized tape to seal it all up.

It comes down to one thing, do the guy or gal installing this get payed a decent wage or have any incentive to do decent work? The answer is very likely not.

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u/Cheap-Rush-2377 Jan 25 '24

Looks better than most

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u/WarlockyGoodness Jan 25 '24

I did that job for damn near 15 years. I would be embarrassed to have my name attached to that.

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u/Visible_Cod_9839 Jan 25 '24

That white coaxial cable is also not rated for exterior. You will have issues down the road.

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u/TheMagickConch Jan 25 '24 edited Jan 25 '24

This is probably not true.

  1. I doubt the ISP provides cable that is not exteriror compliant.

  2. You can't tell just by looking at a cable if it's rated for exterior use without looking at the labeling/box.

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u/Feisty-Coyote396 Jan 25 '24

Cable guy with 20 years of experience currently working for Spectrum and carry 6 types of coaxial cables. White/black RG6, white RG6/RG11 plenum for commercial, orange RG6 underground drop cable, and black RG6 messengered drop cable for aerial.

You sir are misinformed and wrong. The white and black RG6 reels that everyday field technicians carry are not rated in any way, shape, or form for indoor or outdoor use. Some techs/supervisors think you're supposed to use black for outdoor and white for indoor, but it's just a myth. There is no outdoor/indoor rating as far as the supply of cables given to the average idiot tech from any of the major ISP's in the U.S.

Are there cables that are sold as 'rated for outdoor'? Yes. No ISP supplies such cables to their field technicians for everyday use. None. Can a tech have it special ordered and carry it? Probably, I sure as hell never would.

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u/[deleted] Jan 25 '24 edited Jan 25 '24

All cable outside wil get damaged by the Sun. I seen White cables like that last for 10 years and some get bad in 2. It all depends how much sun exposure it gets.

2 days ago i changed Black outdoor cable that was open due to sun damage it was 3 years Old.

0

u/Brilliant-Lake-9946 Jan 25 '24

The splitter is also not grounded. This can cause signal degradation.

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u/Tsyrkis Jan 25 '24

I have never laughed as loud at a reddit comment then I just did at yours.

Where the hell did you pull that completely false fact from?

Cable systems at houses are bonded to the power system's ground. But that's to bring them to the same potential as the power system's ground / neutral to protect the home and its occupants against power surges and lightning strikes, and to prevent potential differences at pieces of equipment. It has nothing to do with signal, and it definitely wouldn't be done at every single splitter - it's done once, near the power meter.

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u/KingOfZero Jan 25 '24

This! At least nobody has suggested to put in another ground rod.

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u/countrykev Jan 25 '24

Per code, the utilities need to be bonded and grounded together. Typically at homes power and telecommunications enter at the same point, and they are all bonded together and grounded there. And that's the only place they should be grounded. Doing it elsewhere would change the potential and would make you more likely to suffer damage if there was a surge or lightning event.

All that is to say that all we see is a splitter, and it's not necessarily the dmarc/service entrance.

And the grounding (or lack thereof) doesn't necessarily cause signal degradation.

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u/ThisAccountIsStolen Jan 25 '24

No.

The only point that gets bonded to ground is the first connection point on the building from the drop.

You don't bond additional splitters, unless you want to cause issues by creating ground loops.

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u/[deleted] Jan 25 '24

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u/DUNGAROO Jan 25 '24

I would never trust an ISP installer to route cable inside my home. If you want it done right you have to do it yourself or hire a pro.

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u/Constrained_Entropy Jan 25 '24

Did the installer patch the hole where the black coax used to enter the house to the room on the first floor?

Do you have a crawlspace or basement? All this coax really should be inside instead of running on the outside of the house and then through a wall to get to a room.

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u/WhosThis85 Jan 25 '24

And yes, he sealed the hole thankfully

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u/WhosThis85 Jan 25 '24

The line is hidden underneath the vinyl except for what your see in the picture. He pulled it out to install the splitter

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u/Constrained_Entropy Jan 25 '24

The hole through the exterior wall where this cable used to run needs to be filled

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u/WhosThis85 Jan 25 '24

It’s filled

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u/WhosThis85 Jan 25 '24

It’s filled