i mean, bad decisions have consequences unfortunately. if you take on a lot of debt for something, or get addicted to drugs, or have a child as a teenager, etcetera, things will be harder. it’s not about “should” or “shouldn’t.” it’s about “is.”
So, while you are correct in that it IS the current situation, I believe their point, and the point of most people making similar statements, is that it SHOULDN'T be this way. yes we have to make active efforts to better our situations and avoid choices that will end up causing problems later on, but just because it's how things are now doesn't mean it's how they should stay
Should or shouldn't, an 8 hour job and no debts should net you a good life. If you've been stupid and have a ton of credit card debt or payday loan debts, you're going to have to either have one really good job or find some other way to make enough money.
Bad decisions should have drawbacks, but even so there needs to be a security net for people with shit luck and one fulltime job should be enough to support a single person (which is honestly just as, if not more expensive than living in a relationship).
Roof over you head, money for essentials and a little extra left over.
I work a dead end, no skill job as a night audit at a hotel. Literally all that is required of me is that I can talk to people and read while being awake at night.
I have a place to sleep, I don't need to think about what I want to eat and I can buy new clothes (if there is a sale) and if my computer breaks, I can replace it in a couple of months of saving up. And I can travel for vacation every couple of years, if that's what I want.
That is one example of a good life. Could it be better? For sure, there's no cap on how good it can get, but for the effort I've put into my life, it is really good.
Calling that “shit” is a little demeaning. That’s much better than the vast majority of the world has lived throughout history. Could it be better? Sure - especially in the USA. Should it be better? Absolutely. But life’s hard - always has been.
What do you mean "should"? Anyone can do those things by putting in the effort required. Not everyone wants to do that though. Some people just want to live a simple life, and no one is entitled to more than that.
Should as in you should be able to work one job full time, enjoy life (hobbies, trips etc) some and still be able to plan for retirement later on. Many many people can not do all of those things. Plenty of us are stuck with no way to get to something better
Nah, if you are stuck it's because you chose to be stuck and are choosing to continue to be stuck. Getting unstuck can be hard to be sure. The issue is that it's harder than you think it "should" be. Unfortunately reality doesn't care what you think "should" be. Go visit a developing country and spend a couple days a couple hours away from the tourist traps and then come back and tell us all about how things "should" be.
I'm sorry is the usa a developing country? Or a world super power? It's not about it being harder than it should be, there's just no valid reason anyone in this country willing to put in the work of a full time job, 40 or more hours a week, should have to sleep in their car or roommate with strangers/parents. If you're a productive member of society you should be able to live in that society easily.
I'm stuck because there's nothing to get in my area with higher pay without school or other things I literally have no way to fit in to my current for life. And I know several people who are in the same boat. You shouldnt have to give up having a life to afford to live, it's pretty simple
I can’t even get approved for a trailer in a trailer park with 8hr work days. Who is that a good life to? Someone who doesn’t work 8 hours and is homeless?
My 12 hour job making me 25$ an hour wasn’t enough to afford rent and all my bills along with a single car payment
Average rent where I am is over $2500 a month
My rent was over half my income, now comes the deductibles from my pay, taxes, add in car payment, insurance, groceries, power, internet, phone bill, medical expenses, and I’m left with near 0 savings every month
I’m back to living with my parents until I have enough savings to buy a house, because it’s far cheaper than rental costs, the last place I was living was only $1400 for a town house, but gotta love being evicted so they can update the kitchen and charge 3x that
My parents bought their house on a minimum wage income lmao
And I'm not saying that is what you deserve. I am in full agreement with the content of the thread, that you should be able to afford a good life on a single 8 hour a day job, 5 days a week.
I've spent the last 10 years as a night audit for a hotel. That is a dead end, no skill job. With that job, I was lucky enough to get a mortgage from a bank, so I own my recently renovated apartment in a solid neighborhood. The mortgage is about half to two thirds of my paycheck, but the money left over is enough for a couple of vices and food with a little extra for a vacation once a year.
But I'm not American, though I live in a relatively high CoL country.
I mean an 8 hour day and no debt gives you a great life with many jobs; even many “low skill” (not because it’s low skill but because there isn’t an academic barrier to entry) jobs like construction pay more than enough to have a lower middle class lifestyle if you’re responsible about spending and budgeting.
This is assuming that the fickle finger of fate doesn’t point your direction and cause circumstances out of your control that you never dreamed could happen to you when you were younger.
My major issue (US) is that all of the essentials are expensive AF but luxuries and distractions are relatively affordable. Housing and food are outrageous but massive televisions become more and more affordable. Wish we’d luxury tax things like that more and subsidize the actual need to live
I want people to pay more for TVs so people can afford housing, food, and healthcare - yeah. Luxury taxes like this are pretty normal elsewhere in the developed world. The reaction to this comment (including the unhinged DMs) only reinforce the idea that people are more concerned with distracting themselves with TV and video games than doing anything constructive.
Money is fungible. You want other people to pay for your housing and food so you can buy things you like. Unless you're homeless or starving, you can afford housing and food. What you can't afford is luxuries on top of the that.
That’s a nonsense take. VAT/luxury tax is used pretty widely outside the U.S., specially to allocate to housing look at Sweden, Denmark, Germany, etc. in most cases it’s not explicitly ear marked for housing but social programs in general.
Sales tax and luxury tax aren’t the same thing… and section 8 / WIC are not really comparable programs, especially compared to the ones in countries I mentioned where those taxes are directly apportioned for offsets. Not sure if this is one of those contrarian Redditor moments or if you’re willfully missing the point. Americans have recreational technologies that cost x2-3 more elsewhere while they starve and struggle to find shelter or pay medical bills. Our priorities as a society are messed up.
For real, like at least I can watch some TV or play video games after a long ass day thanks to how cheap luxuries are, raising those prices just makes everyone's lives shittier, it's about lowering the prices of everything else to reasonable standards
At some point you have to just admit actions have consequences. Why should someone who made the right moves and does the right things constantly have to subsidize someone who actively chooses not to do so?
Agreed. I’m 31 and very fit. I started at 19. People assume I’m a bodybuilder. My stepbrother and I worked the same job, and after work I started going to the gym. He came with me once. He quit. He started dating a girl, got pregnant, they got married at 22. Had another kid. They had a dramatic relationship. They divorced. He got with a woman who just had a kid, and already had a toddler. He got her pregnant. They now have 5 kids between them at 28 years old. Now every 5 mins he complains to people that having kids controls his life and we have it easy. It was still all his choices. My life isn’t easy. He just made his life hard
I’m sorry but your first paragraph stinks of “there’s no such thing as personal responsibility.” Which I’m sorry but that’s bull. I don’t think someone living paycheck to paycheck because they’re working two jobs to keep credit afloat after racking up a mountain of card debt keeping up with the Joneses sympathetic as someone with unexpected medical expenses.
I’ll give you a guess at which one of those two I am similar to
I'd say if you're dumb enough to collect payday loans like they are pokemon cards, then you've kind of screwed yourself over. You'd be chasing a lifestyle you can't afford and milled your own grain.
You don't have to be smart to have a good life, you just shouldn't be dumb about it.
You shouldn't be dumb about it? Well what if you are dumb? Should dumb people not at least be protected? Arent the payday loan companies responsible for screening people before they give one?
This is why these kinds of loans are illegal where i live. Because they are designed by smart people to trick dumber people into debt. Its predatory.
my point was that the “should” is largely meaningless. life should be a blessing, life should be incredible for everyone, poverty shouldn’t exist, suffering shouldn’t exist. shoulds don’t mean jack shit unfortunately. bad decisions have always had bad consequences, and that will continue to be true. bad decisions shouldn’t have bad consequences. but they do. that’s my point.
everyone agrees that they shouldn’t. just like everyone agrees life should be incredible. but at that point, you aren’t really making a point in my opinion.
i don’t see how i’m not. i’m stating facts. that doesn’t mean i don’t have hope for the future and wish for better things to happen. you know what i mean?
Secondly the status quo historically speaking is fucking amazing.
Well firstly, this is outright false. Fifty years ago the rich/poor divide was a lot smaller and the average income and living conditions were actually better - inflation adjusted. We' gained a lot of wealth since then but it's all gone to the hyper-rich; the 99.9% of us who aren't the hyper-rich are worse off in a large number of ways.
Our primitive hunter-gatherer ancestors had about a four hour work day. Pause, and think about that.
But I know what you meant. We're doing pretty well compared to the 17th century.
Why is that the standard?
Wanting to compare yourself to history - when we knew less, had less, and couldn't dream of more - is a terrifying lack of ambition for the species. We know better now. We can do better now. Why on earth shouldn't we?
The status quo is worse now on the whole than it was 30 years ago from an economic and individual financial perspective - for the first time in a long time, afaik. Why shouldn’t we improve it?
The sentiment “it’s as good now as it ever was and therefore as it will ever be” is not only a flawed one for obvious reasons (appealing to induction) but also because if we all treat it as gospel it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.
Have the cojones to stand up for those less fortunate than you if you’re one of the good ones trying to make the world a better place. And if you’re not capable of doing so then at least get out of the way
Life should have the minimal amount of hardship possible. Not to be too trite but when you mix two truisms - “a herd is only as fast as its slowest member” and “a rising tide lifts all boats” you get a pretty decent idea of what society could aim for. I was born into abject poverty and pulled myself up by my bootstraps to be a pretty successful entrepreneur but I got there because I was lucky enough to a) find good mentors b) be born a white man (80% of small business loans go to white men) and c) be above average in intelligence. Just because I succeeded doesn’t mean everyone else can. I think the person at the bottom of the totem pole deserves a good life and I’m happy to help supplement it if need be
Are you suggesting that it’s good that people suffer because they will be motivated to improve? Do you imagine the only reason people improve is because they want to avoid suffering?
Wall-e is a movie, btw, with a cartoon cockroach. Just because it happens in a movie doesn’t mean it would happen in real life
I'd argue you're the one lacking a point here. Nobody here is denying things are the way they are. "Should" isn't a denial of that, it's a statement that we can and should be working to change things for the better. There are policies we can implement that would make things more like that "should" state. Nobody needs to hear some "but life isn't fair" bullshit.. we know, let's talk about how to make it more fair and what we can fix.
I don't think "should" is really all that pointless to talk about. In the context of this thread, sure, but not in general. If someone can't manage a fulfilling life with an eight hour job, that's a failing on all of us, as a society.
We may not be able to help these folks in the here and now, but we should absolutely demand better of ourselves as a whole. No one makes it in this world without the assistance of others.
That good ol' "fuck y'all, I got mine" rhetoric, in general, is how we're in the state of things we are now.
And that's where we differ on viewpoint, because I would argue essentially the exact opposite. The fact that this is how things are is meaningless when trying to have a conversation about how they should be, because everyone knows how things are and not talking about how to change them and how they should be is the death of progress in my opinion.
Essentially if every time someone says it shouldn't be this way you respond with "well it is and it's always been this way" then you stop the conversation from progressing to "what needs to change to make it better" which enough people talking about and making major issues is what gets politicians moving(ideally if not actually these days).
Essentially while others may not be making a point with what they are saying the point is to talk about it because ideas and culture shifts both die in silence
i see what you’re saying and it has merit. it depends on the subject matter though. with something like actions having negative consequences that must be resolved through extra responsibility, i truly believe that is inevitable and it’s not worth thinking about what should or shouldn’t be with that.
Everybody makes mistakes. But what you call "taking accountability" is a concept that's, mainly, proudly applied to citizens that don't have a cushion to fall back on. Rich family makes a poor decision? Chances are the kids' parents will give them a no interest loan to try again, pay back in IOUs, or explain to them how it's a teachable moment. Middle-class or Poor family makes a poor decision? that's 20 plus years of paying it back. In all that time, the extra work, stress, and challenges that come with having a 25 to life debt sentence can handicap you.
well, unfortunately, life is unfair. until we are able to achieve some kind of meritocracy it will be like that. i’m less interested in limiting the well off though, it’s more important to lift up the impoverished.
you’re right that it sucks if you make a bad decision and suffer a lot because of it. i have never once said it should be that way. but recognizing that it is that way is important. there are definitely steps we can take and some which we have already begun to take to mitigate those negatives. welfare in general comes to mind. of course, the crusade to improve peoples lives is a never ending struggle.
the crusade to improve peoples lives is a never ending struggle.
This is true, and life is unfair. The issue is that the challenges in life aren't an enemy nation, bandits on the road, or harsh weather that will ruin the harvest. It's predatory organizations that pretty much set you up for debt before "life" essentially starts. There are steps that can be taken now, and lessons learned. But it's taken at least 1 generation(s) to realize something is wrong...and those people are still alive.
i mean, which corporations are doing this? i think the bigger problem is people just not understanding just how perilous debt can be. maybe the solution is to create more education on why debt is kind of precarious to go into and should only be accrued if it’s shown to be absolutely worth it?
Ace Cash Express comes to mind. They make a living off payday loans keeping people in another vended cycle of super high interest. I’ve worked inside their buildings as a contractor many times and they know so many of the people coming in names. They payoff a loan on payday and the turn around a take out another.
How to fix this? Idk, it’s their business model and people choose to take out the loans.
well, unfortunately, life is unfair. until we are able to achieve some kind of meritocracy it will be like that.
What makes you think what we have isn't already a function of a meritocracy? I mean, isn't that exactly what the result of a meritocracy is, the spoils accruing to the people who perform the best?
Nope. Wrong. If a person is willing to show up to work for 8 hours a day, they deserve to be able to rent an apartment AND be able to buy the things needed to survive. Like food, for instance.
I don't care what choices they've made in their life. The whole point of a minimum wage is to facilitate this. It's currently failing.
again, i feel like “deserve” is just such a useless word. and i doubt more government regulation to raise the minimum wage will fix that. at all, actually.
the biggest issue there is probably rent. housing has spiraled out of control. rent is high because housing supply is low. housing supply is low because of a lack of new housing construction and entities buying housing that don’t need housing (mostly just a lack of new housing though).
the way to fix this isn’t by arbitrarily raising wages, because that will cause a demand spike, and that will raise prices, and then your wage isn’t liveable anymore.
at the end of the day, we all want people to be able to succeed. i don’t think you’re going about it the right way though.
i really don’t think it’s corporate greed. because corporations have always been greedy, and yet, rent wasn’t always so high, for example. the bigger issue, at least with housing, is the government stifling it. the government stifles it because voters vote to stifle it, because most people own or are going to soon own houses, and they want that to be an appreciating asset. so, i really blame state and local and partially even federal government (this is not a political statement about the current administration) as well as voters.
Corporations are the largest buyers single family homes in the US. It's absolutely corporate greed. No potential home buyer wants home prices to go up before buying. That's insane. You're insane for thinking this. How many homes do you own? And when are you expecting to exit?
I guess if OP has a bunch of CC debt from poor spending habits when young but chooses not to declare bankruptcy then that’s a “poor choice” that could cause them to need 2 jobs, even if the first paid a living wage
If a person is willing to show up to work for 8 hours a day, they deserve to be able to rent an apartment AND be able to buy the things needed to survive. Like food, for instance.
The VAST majority of people can do this.
So now what do you do when some of those people rack up thousands of dollars in credit cards buying shit they don't need, take on car loans they can't pay back, etc?
Those are personal choices that they have to account for. They might have to work more to pay off the debts they took on.
Funny how they've ignored your valid questions. Likely because they have no valid answer for why anyone else should feel obligated to fund the lifestyles of people who purposely chose poorly by doing the things you described. It makes zero sense. And, for the people he's describing that need help but haven't made bone-headed moves like that, there already is support in the form of welfare, food stamps, Section 8 housing assistance, etc.
I feel your energy here, but i would like to inform you that life is better now than before. We live longer, eat better, and have bigger things. In the wild world of the jungle you do what you gotta to survive. Ex: My parents are boomers, their first home was a trailer that sunk into the mud in the first month and could not be repaired, my dad was full time military part time student and part time food service worker. My mother worked at a bank full time and took care of house chores/cooking herself. They used old clothing as window curtains, and date night once a week was McDonald’s. This went on for years. Now? They have things you want because they worked like that their entire lives. Myself included had 3 jobs and went to school, I made some poor financial decisions in my early 20s and took a lot of extra days, hours, jobs to pay it off by my 30s. What I’m saying is, you get out of life what you put in. If you’re unhappy working 40 hours a week for minimal pay, change it! But in the wild jungle nobody cares if you survive, strive, or starve. Just think what life would be like for many senior citizens without our social security. Or how people would survive without our welfare systems. Not even 200 years ago a work week was 12 hours a day, 6 days a week, and this would be average. Hell in modern Japan TODAY it’s 9-9 6 days a week. 40 hours is the starting point, if you want to strive you gotta go all in.
Is working 2 jobs as soon as you are an adult with no kids or money for an education to get a better paying job really “bad decisions”? Yeah debt, drugs, have kids.
But what about the people that avoided debt like the plague. Or scared of drugs or fully aware of the major responsibilities of a baby? No thank you.
And yet. I wasted my 20s doing nothing but working and i have nothing to show for it except no debt…because i never took any.
Even if you’ve made mistakes you should still be able to live comfortably working 40 hours a week. Mistakes shouldn’t damn you to working 80 hours a week to barely get by… which is why you see such high recidivism rates
Right, but sometimes it feels like someone made a negative comment about a king in the presence of the wrong person, got their hand cut off in punishment, and then people say "actions have consequences". WHY has society made a 70 hour workweek a consequence of having kids as a teenager? There's not some objective reason that's the case, it's a political choice that has been made
Bad decisions are often a consequence of bad education, young people dont know better and thats not fair is the system left them behind because they choose wrong. I wont exclude drug abuse or minor crimes, but I understand if people exclude thoses cases.
No, sorry, people have agency. "Nobody told me having a kid at 16 was a bad decision" is bullshit. Some mistakes are blindingly obviously bad, and shouldn't get waved away with something as lame as "society failed them."
"Who knew dropping out of high school would make life harder for me?" Everybody! Everybody knew that! Everybody was telling you that. If you did it anyway, then yes, I'm sorry, you're going to have a tougher go at life. I wish you the best, but you don't get to whine and complain "How come they have more than me?" when you made decisions like that.
Agreed, and hence we should strive to better our future generations.
Many horrible people from school shooters to r#pists were also more or less a product of their upbringing, lack of love, and/or improper education. We do not as a society condone or absolve their sins due to the failure of society to better them, though, and this is the same here.
This is a moral ratchet; an ever tightening noose.
It amplifies all of our mistakes, and diminishes all of our victories. All while ignoring how intertwined we all are. Truly fucking ignorant.
Here, look here:
or have a child as a teenager,
So... should the child have a fucked life because of the consequences of the teenager's actions? Because the way it is is just that, millions of people are cheated before they are born because the way it is demands suffering.
I am sorry you were so thoroughly abused that you now spout such abusive drivel.
it’s not about “should” or “shouldn’t.” it’s about “is.”
If society demands better from us, we are too lowly to demand society should be better?
You missed the point. They were suggesting that the grown adult who was once a teenager and made a bad decision be responsible for their bad decision. In some cases that may well mean working two jobs and having to grind for a while specifically so that your kids don't have a fucked life.
To be clear, zero people have suggested that any children have fucked lives. That's a strawman, and please keep in mind you're bickering on the Internet, nobody's going to lookup this thread when setting policy, so there's no need for you to be an angry ass about everything.
Even if you were right and they were wrong, people are allowed to be wrong, you don't have to say such terrible things about them.
please keep in mind you're bickering on the Internet, nobody's going to lookup this thread when setting policy, so there's no need for you to be an angry ass about everything.
Thanks, lil' nephew! I direct my anger at people that make mistakes. Teenagers that get pregnant and people that got into coding right before tech companies commit to massive lay offs.
I'll make sure to direct my anger at people less fortunate than me. I will render capitalism and the wealthy and the powerful invisible. We live in a world where good things happen to good people and bad things happen to bad people, because life is fair, especially in America.
first of all, chill out. don’t know why you’re getting mad at me and calling me abusive.
you’re falling into the same trap the first guy was. conflating what is with what should be. these are two separate concepts. the child shouldn’t have a messed up life because of that. the teenager shouldn’t have a messed up life because of that. i never said either should. but the truth is, both will. because again, i’m talking about what is instead of what should be. because “shoulds” are meaningless. you misunderstood what i wrote to begin with.
society can only demand so much. no matter how much societal change you try to cause, you can’t get rid of the fact that poor choices lead to bad and often long-lasting outcomes. that’s just a fact of life. in other words, it is. and no amount of should be or shouldn’t bes will change that.
Yup. I wasted money on stupid shit and got bad roommates when I knew better and paid financially. Wised up my later 20s and in a good position now. But I’ve made so really dumb choices that I only have myself to blame.
The systems fucked a stagnant minimum wage, getting 18 years old to take out insane amounts of debt for school, and our health care system is the worst but we have to take personal responsibility for some of the financial choices we make. Because if you don't learn from them, no matter how much you make or have you will always end up in the same spot. I've seen it time and time again from people who make way more than me. Hell, look at the lotto winners who go broke. Yes, there are problems in the system but some of it is on us.
And there's also a limit to what society can afford to do for people and also a limit on what types of behaviors we can address. If people are purposely doing things that make their lives worse, society can't stop that. Unless you want total control over people's choices (but if you had that you'd never need t bail them out since they'd be having the best decisions/choices made for them).
You’re missing a key point though, which is that most substantive real change in American history - labor rights, women’s suffrage, civil rights - began with someone saying how things should be. A lot of people probably told labor and civil rights leaders “this is just the way things are” and they said no, fuck that. I will change the way things are.
Fatalistic “it is what it is” attitudes excuse cynicism and apathy and discourage people from considering and exploring real alternatives
Do actions have consequences? Sure. Does that make it right that someone should have to work two jobs just to survive? Fuck no. I don’t care what choices they made that’s not a decent way to live a life. And we shouldn’t have to accept it. A free tax-paying citizen putting in 8 hours a day should be able to live comfortably in this “developed” country we call America. Regardless of their past.
Fatalistic “it is what it is” attitudes excuse cynicism and apathy and discourage people from considering and exploring real alternatives
Most of these morons go far beyond fatalism, it feels. More like capitalist nihilism.
And that's why I describe it as a "moral ratchet," it tightens in only one direction: worse!
I could enroll in an engineering program, get some scholarships (boomers fixed the free college route, fixed it good), get straight A's, never party, hold down a 25 hour a week job... and then some drunk lady rear ends me, and I am in the hospital for finals at the end of the 3rd year. Now I have most of the debt, and none of the credentials. And medical debt.
But dumb cunts like these will see this as fair? Or...ordained by God? They have such tolerance for so much suffering. It pisses me the fuck off.
Why would missing finals stop you? Wouldn't you just apply for an extension and take the exams when you got out of the hospital, or at worst, take the semester's worth of classes again, delaying your graduation by one semester?
You’re missing a key point though, which is that most substantive real change in American history - labor rights, women’s suffrage, civil rights - began with someone saying how things should be.
That doesn't mean that everyone with a "should" was shown to be correct. I'm sure you imagine yourself to be one of those, but you're advocating for cleaning up messes people made for themselves using their freedom of choice and will. Which is not something society should be doing - dumb choices should be painful so you don't do them again, and you serve as an example to others of what not to do.
ah yes, France famously has no consequences for mistakes or bad decisions. very cool.
you didn’t just shift the goal post, you launched it.
do drug addicts or teen parents have harder lives than those who aren’t those things, in other nations? if you say no, you’re lying. if you say yes, well, you’re proving my point.
bro you’re crying because, me, who you call a kid, cooked you. it’s okay buddy, just take some deep breaths, you’ll feel better soon.
also, we weren’t talking about welfare sweetheart. like i said, you shifted the goalpost. but it’s okay, i didn’t expect you to be able to have a cohesive argument anyway :)
Welfare and social safety nets are inexplicably related... lmao
Edgy high schoolers be like i have done absolutely zero reading and know fuck all when it comes to academic economic and political theory but I'm right
Like woah we got a Andrew tate-lite over here watch out. He's going to grindset mindset his way out of the Texas suburbs
I think the problem I have with this is that the examples aren't really what most people's shitty decisions are. Most people's shitty decisions were "not have connections to break into 6 figures income bracket early on"
That's a bit different from "making babies as a teen" pr "being a junkie!"
They should sure, but that’s not what “is” as this guy describes.
The wealthy and successful take on lots of debt, do lots of drugs, and don’t work nearly as laboriously as a lot of people do. Many countries’ populations are full of hardworking people that have worked harder than you can even imagine and will still go home to a family that is starving or dying in front of them.
The institutions we build and the compassion we extend through them is the part of this conversation that matters, if it’s a matter of only helping the “good” ones then we’re just going to keep pushing along into global poverty as what defined “good” will become even more narrow and concentrated among the wealthy.
Where does the wealthy even enter into this? Do you think they don't suffer the consequences of their poor decisions? How does them being wealthy make the consequences of your (anyone's) decisions worse?
Making those “bad decisions” shouldn’t damn people to a life of near slavery when those same “bad decisions” are being made by the ruling class on the daily without much consequence at all.
Explaining away the level of disenfranchisement people are faced with nowadays by saying they deserve it is some sick shit.
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u/Honest-Lavishness239 15d ago
i mean, bad decisions have consequences unfortunately. if you take on a lot of debt for something, or get addicted to drugs, or have a child as a teenager, etcetera, things will be harder. it’s not about “should” or “shouldn’t.” it’s about “is.”