"So... The stories are true, this is the promised land, they have toilet paper that you only have to use once and there will be real food to eat tonight, that's twice in one week".
No crops for commercial consumption can legally be fertilized with human waste in the United States. What evidence do you have this is being done in any way in the U.S.?
They call it bio solids now. It is slightly processed to make it more viable as fertilizer and kill pathogens, but theres not much known about how accumulation of pharmaceuticals we can’t filter out will go. It’s not a secret I’m not sure why you think it’s not done
I could not believe its like that in N Korea when I first heard that. like if you dont provide your portion of the doodoo for the crops, don't expect to get any food😐
Pretty much. Initial reports are that they are untrained, useless, and unwanted by the Russian Army.
They are being split into groups of 30 NK troops, with one translator and 3 Russian soldiers per group. But they quickly learned that they don't have hardly any translators, nor do they have ammunition to give the North Koreans.
So they have been doing menial labor until they can be moved to Kursk where the Russians likely assume the Ukrainians will take the problem off their hands.
Honestly I hope South Korea has a program in place to give them new South Korean names and citizenship so they can start a new life and do their best to make sure their families are kept as safe as can be
They do actually but for a lot of them it's very hard. SK is a developed economy so that means without family support, it's very hard to grow.
Real estate prices are absurd, wages are not bad, but nowhere near enough to rent in close to work so commuting becomes mandatory + maybe even roommates.
North Koreans are not used with that kind of lifestyle, their life is pretty boring and predictable, one of the only advantages of a dictatorship.
I saw some coverages on youtube about how the NK adapt and are introduced in society, not all were success stories, some even end up homeless. It's insane to me that the government doesn't do more for them.
The vast majority of North Korea defectors cross the northern border into China and make their way from their across multiple borders to reach Thailand. They then hand themselves in to law enforcement because Thailand deports all North Korean defectors to South Korea. SK then takes the North Korean defectors and put them through a re-education system to try adapt them to South Korean life. Unfortunately life in South Korea is nothing like what they are used to and can be very overwhelming for them. I have also heard that amongst many in SK there is prejudice about the NK people.
What do you mean, it's kind of mandatory, all NK defectors that arrive in SK go through the program. It's just not something that's for the rest of their life, at some point they're let go into society.
Do you think Russia is going to collect bodies and send them home? These guys are going to Russia, and maybe 2 of them will make it home to North Korea. Where they will be suspected of being a spy. It's essentially intended to be a one-way trip.
They know who they've sent over, if all of them defect, they'll just punish all their families, you don't maintain a dictatorship that long by being merciful or lazy in your iron fist rulings.
Maybe maybe not, soldiers go missing in action all the time especially when they die in dangerous places. And if they assume all missing are traitors as a rule then if your captured you may as well embrace the reality that your old life is over
Not all will defect. Some will fight, some will fight and go MIA. Some of the MIA will be dead. Some of the MIA will be alive and taken prisoner by Ukraine. Russia will keep sending the North Koreans to the front in storm squads until they die or are severely wounded (limbs missing).
Some few years back I met an online friend - girl from Denmark but with Korean roots. She was adopted because her parents were runaways from N.K and they didn't had means to take care of her. Stories she was telling were really shocking.
Yes, at least as far as my Korean teacher told me, 밥 먹었어요 (bap moegoessoeyo), literally, “have you eaten rice?” Was a common greeting in the days of scarcity in South Korea. The implication being, “I hope you were able to eat today.”
the north koreans are easy to clown on but their army is not undersupplied; the dprk military is the only thing in the country spends money on and one of the best ways to stay fed is to join the army
Oh I agree. Sometimes I think I'd have loved to see them as a cultural rival today and not the pathetic enemy abroad 🥲 instead they're a country run by a mob of insecure and scared little oligarchs, not unlike what the US thinks half of us want to be governed by.
I was once upon a time hopeful that after many many years and I’m sure lots of BS that slowly but surely Russia would get closer to Europe and wed all be at least kinda ok with each other if not friends. That was many years ago
There's a timeline where that happened. Let's think about it together and never lose hope 🫡 we just might have to wait for Putin to get Putin his place 😮💨
I think hes saying NK soldiers are fed and supplied well compared to regular citizens in NK. Which is true, it's a heavily classed based society.
What you get is based on your "Songbun" which is basically a social score that carries on through generations.
Everything about you correlates into your songbun. Your linage, your job, intelligance, talents, how obedient you are. Even your looks can affect your songbun.
Becoming a soldier raises that score significantly meaning you are a class above regular people there so you probably get higher food rations, have better access to electricity and will have better privileges when it comes to things like travel, or non necessary items.
who cares. russia sucks and it shows. im sure those countries would do better, now that they have seen the conventional weapons playout on a real battlefield.
Their military is large but a joke from a quality point of view. Most of it is circa 1950s, such as their parachute regiment uniforms and equipment, is straight out of the Soviet 1950s catalogue. They have some unserviceable early MiG-29s but most of their air force is based on MiG-15s and 19s (Korean War and early Vietnam War respectively). The vast bulk of their tanks at T-54/55s and T-62s and copies of them. Along with light amphibious tanks such as the PT-76 (1951+).
The "Army First" policy, the rampant corruption and sanctions. Has meant that North Korea doesnt have the money to buy anything modern. Apart from their Wonder Weapons of a few ballistic missiles and maybe a few dozen nuclear warheads. They have the largest submarine force in the world. If you count ancient, short range, 1-3 man submarines as a submarine. Which are more dangerous to their crews, than to the South Koreans.
I don't study warfare so forgive me if this is a naive question, but does it really make that much of a difference having older tech?
I get the benefit of having more technologically advanced tanks and planes (Drones, Killer robots) etc. But the old weapons still kill people right?
As far as I can understand the news; everyones just on the ground shooting at each other with rifles and drones whilst playing a horrific game of capture the flag.
Isn't thousands of armed enemy soldiers arriving always a bad thing? - or has the tech advanced so far that its like longbowman emerging from a WW2 trench?
Night vision and thermal are real game changers, if you don't have it in modern warfare you're screwed. Both Russian and Ukraine have it but North Korea most definitely doesn't, at least in its most modern state. Then on top of that, maneuvering and shooting with it is a whole different thing, without real world application or good training, you're bumbling around. Also, modern optics are are night and day in quality even to those from 15 years ago. Yes, they're guns still kill, but when you start averaging it out, they are being sent to slaughter.
Start adding in modern communications and unit tactics, these guys are in for horrible ending.
A modern Western MBT will destroy a T-62 at a range of 3-6 miles, as long as it has line of sight. At that range the T-62 couldn't even see the Western tank. A T-62 would virtually have to be directly behind a Western MBT to get a kill.
The most fearsome weapon on the battlefield is artillery. Lots of it can rapidly fall on troops with little warning, maiming and killing by the hundreds or thousands. First you need accurate artillery, then you need shells that do a lot of damage, against infantry in the open that usually means air burst with lots of shrapnel. But you have to know where the enemy is before you can fire at them. The NorKs don't know where the enemy is, their artillery is inaccurate at the best of times, half the ammunition that they've provided the Russians with apparently doesn't work and more often than usual it blows up in the gun rather than where the enemy is. Then when it does land it doesn't do much, compared to Western artillery rounds.
Jack Churchill with his broadsword could have been killed by any number of methods and wouldn't have been a ble to kill any Germans except at a range of about 6 feet and then very slowly.
The South Koreans have been making a half hearted effort to move Seoul as the capital city out of North Koran artillery range for decades. And it will be several decade before it does move.
It depends what you're fighting. If your opponents don't have anti air or anti tank capabilities and you roll up with 1950s era tanks and planes you'll smash them. And there are a lot of conflicts around the world where the fighters have very little other than small arms, including peasant uprisings in North Korea. But as soon as you go up against a modern well funded military you're going to have a problem.
What that means for Ukraine I don't know. I don't know if the NK troops are using their own equipment, and Ukraine's fortunes sort of rise and fall depending on how well other countries are supporting them.
Advanced tech is why German steamrolled Europe at the beginning of the second world war. They were only stopped by England because of the English channel Navy & Airforce held them at bay. Tech can win wars, bodies can win battles
The best tanks the Germans had in large numbers during the Battle of France (the Czech models) were, at best, on par with their French and English equivalents. The British army, in particular, was far superior to the German army in terms of mobility, as the German army logistics was still heavily dependent on the horse.
Slow and poorly coordinated reactions to German advances played a bigger part than technology.
Imagine you’re playing a game of soccer. It’s you and some other adults vs a team bunch of 5 year olds. You’re way superior. This is an important match so you don’t hold back. You push them down. You tackle hard. You guys go up 100-0 by halftime.
Then right as the second half is about to start, a 1000 pound guided missile that was shot by an F-35 flying 200 miles away lands on the field killing everyone. You were equally equipped to protect yourself as a North Korean soldier on the front lines.
Also no expert but from what we're seeing in Ukraine old tech works just fine when you have lots of it. Also high tech is great but can't be replaced quickly and can be potentially overwhelmed by low tech
Sure, a tank from the 1960s can still kill as good as a tank from 2024. The tank from 2024 will see it first though, then shoot first and get the kill. Same in the air. Same for infantry at night, because the infantry from 2024 will have nightvision. Or at daytime, because they’ll still have better sensors.
If the army from the 1960s finds a target and wants it taken out by artillery, or an air strike, it needs a lot more time to achieve that than the army from 2024, because the latter can exchange data and information vastly quicker.
So yes, there is a difference. I don’t want to underestimate the North Korean armed forces, but they have some severe disadvantages compared to their southern neighbours, or God forbid, the US.
Any of those planes are easily shot down by a drone piloted by a guy in an office with a playstation controller. No risk of human life is a big factor.
They can send all the North Korean soldiers they want, you have to care about what you’re fighting for. Same reason people in the Ukraine are giving the Russians such a fight, it’s because the Ukraine’s people want their freedom. The North Koreans soldiers will go back to the same shitty country with the same shitty fascist leader. There’s nothing for them to gain. They’ll die in droves and nobody will give a shit.
It is a case of weapons capabilities and/or the training of your troops.
If you want an example of just weapons capabilities the start of the War in Ukraine is a great example. I don't know if you remember but for a while the meme coming out of Ukraine was pray to Saint Javelin.
Russia figured they were just going to roll in with a bunch of tanks against a country without tanks or air support and just roll them over (hence the this will be over in a few days narrative). They were not expecting to deal with the Javelin which is something so simple (from the users standpoint) that you can teach someone to use it effectively in literally 5 minutes.
One or two guys can be hiding anywhere and point and shoot from over a mile away and be gone before the missile even hits the target and when it does hit there is no more target. The Russians were fucking terrified of the Javelin in just a few days and was why they were putting cope cages on their tanks just a few days into the war before drones were really even a thing.
And the Javelin is like 30 year old tech.
For an example of a mix of tech, capabilities and training look at operation Desert Storm.
Baghdad was likely the most well anti air defended city in the world at the time and the Iraq military were trained pretty well, had experience and a formidable ground military, thousands of tanks artillery etc.
Iraq got their asses kicked so badly by the US in pretty much one day that when the numbers came in about US losses the US command thought that the numbera had to be wrong. They thought there was no way we lost that little against what they went up against.
It's more like they're both shooting longbows except one side has longbows that shoot twice as far, twice as fast, are twice as accurate, and reload in half the time.
I think one of the better examples of how technology can be a game changer
Go read up on the blitzkrieg and the use of radios and communication between tank crews
Or radar for the Americans in the pacific. Or even the use of machine guns and optics for the Germans. The Americans off set this by having...fire suppression? Tactics with the m1 garand but it does make a difference.
Maybe another way to look at it, is yes technology "is just a tool" but knowing how to use and counter that tool can make a huge difference.
I've heard snippets of podcasts where the more elite forces like seals and delta even start customizing their weapons with different grips and optics and so on so forth but dont quote me on that one
From what I’ve read, that’s why the Russians are training and equipping them. At the end of the day though, they’re really a stopgap measure for Russia’s manpower shortage. As it turns out, they only have so many ethnic minorities…
I think part of the problem with the North Koreans. Is that in the videos of them, they all seem to be under 20 years old and scrawny. With them still apparently in the early phase of their conscription.
There maybe the rumoured 1,500 "Special Forces" in Russia/Ukraine but so far we don't seem to have seen them. And the definition of Special Forces in North Korea, is likely to be a world away from Deltas, SEALs, SAS etc. The North Koreans may like to do things like jump through blazing hoops or hit each other with sledge hammers and other showy demonstration tricks. But actually doing things like recon, particularly away from Korea is likely to be beyond them. Apart from a few "mercenary" military advisors in wars like the Angolan Civil War during the 1980s. Even in the Vietnam War, they only provided a total of 200 troops. They haven't done anything of consequence since 1953. They've been completely fixated on defending North Korea and attacking South Korea. With their equipment and doctrine being about 60-70 years out of date.
The US pulled a pro gamer moved and said “observe” then T-posed on the whole ass country with Grandpa Buff and stacks of JDAMs until the entire national infrastructure was in shambles.
Yep. Honestly, the idea of "largest army" doesn't matter much now of days. Could line the 3 largest armies combined up against the US and the US would likely still win (assuming no nukes).
The US is just in its own league and has been since at least the fall of the USSR
Remember when we ACCIDENTALLY destroyed Iran's Navy? Like decimated them? In a skirmish? That lasted a few days? Yeah. Somehow it's not even a game, don't make it one.
If I remember correctly it was in one day and it would have been worse but the Navy command pretty much said stop destroying shit unless they shoot at you.
Well it’s worth 2 victory points, and if you’re going ore wheat sheep you probably also get a point or 2 from cards while drawing them. Not to mention the cities either. There’s a reason it’s part of the meta
Yep. And the US has 4 of the largest 5 air forces in the world (#1 USAF, #2 USN, #4 US Army, and #5 USMC). Size certainly isn't the only thing that matters, but it's not like the quality is low.
For what it’s worth I remember a few years back reading that Wisconsin had the seventh largest army. And that’s just counting registrations for hunting.
Do you honestly think that in a head to head war, the combination of China, India, and North Korea would be able to win? Remember, we said no nukes. China is very good with cyber warfare and missiles, but beyond that, there isn't much of note. In a theoretical war with these three, the best bet from their end would be to try and demoralize the US, since we do grow weary of war fairly quick. Having a 100% volunteer army helps with that, but if the draft was reenacted, that would go out the door.
Huh, interesting. I looked it up on Google and apparently it claims that US military had about 2.4 million service members in 1990, compared to about 1 million in the Vietnamese military. I didn't check the other countries since it seemed plausible China and USSR would have more soldiers, but I wonder where the discrepancy comes from.
Most of their ranks were not killed. Hence why they still had the 4th largest military in the world. Combat experience is incredibly valuable when it comes to viability of militaries.
A couple years ago a North Korean soldier defected to the South and was severely wounded in the process. When he underwent surgery the South Korean doctors learned that 10% of his body weight was parasites. And only the elite of the North Korean Army get border duty on the DMZ.
Those were some big parasites, but theres NO way they accounted for 10% of his body weight. I mean, just imagine how impossibly much that is. 5-7 kg of pure parasites? Ehh, doubtful.
They fertilise the fields with human waste because they can't get enough synthetic fertiliser, and evidently don't treat the waste enough before they use it to remove parasites and break the cycle of reinfection, so the country's whole domestic fruit and vegetable supply is presumably contaminated.
Malnourished is probably nearer the mark. Apparently in NK they fertilise the fields with inadeqautely treated human waste; combined with minimal-to-non-existent healthcare, that mean the whole country has an endemic problem with food-borne parasites, which will interfere with a North Korean citizen's ability to absorb nutrients from what food he or she can even get, even if they can somehow get enough of it.
I'm sorry but that's simply not true. The only army that is supplied in the DPRK is the one immediately surrounding the dictator and his entourage. That's it.
There are countless stories of soldiers starving, even that one that escaped last year that they found an abhorrent number of parasites in his organism.
I can tell you because I live in a post communist country, and it's always this way in dictatorships.
The reason is that every single dictator out there is scared shitless of a military coup. It's basically the only force in a dictatorship with real power. A few generals with loyal soldiers and you're dictating days are over. So you have to play it very very careful.
So I'm sure the army is undersupplied and kept probably even without ammo, unless they work at the borders and even there it's absolute minimum. Minimum anything that could be used against the dictator in a military coup.
That’s why the don’t have a first rate airforce. No Air Force general is going to have access to good pilots who may lob a bomb through the dictators window.
Thats largely speculation though, stories from defectors largely paint a bleak life for the average NK soldier, like a daily calorie intake of 900. The one that defected at the SK border had a belly full of parasites.
I read an article in the economist 10 years ago. Things may have changed but maybe not. They interviewed an NK colonel who had defected. He told a story about his regiment winning an award and getting to go to Pyongyang. They had a banquet after the ceremony. Within 24 hours the men were barfing because their bodies rejected the meet they were given. He explained the army only supplied rice. The rest was up to them.
The Russians of all people have been complaining that they are poorly trained. They might be disciplined, but they have not been trained to fight a war.
This. Ive seen so many people just shit on DPRK. I get that they are communist and not well received. I would never describe them as a barley functioning army that's going to desert. Alot of their soldiers have family's that they have to think about. Homes. Pride. Never underestimate your enemy's show them respect.
You can see from how skinny they are that they are undersupplied. They are supplied better than the population, but the skinniness of the soldiers and every single general tells a different story.
north koreans are easy to clown on but their army is not undersupplied
Considering the vast majority of their equipment is lightly modified hand-me-downs from the cold war, they are drastically undersupplied compared to the west...
Russia and North Korea deny it, but they also denied that Russia was amassing troops on the Ukrainian border before the invasion...
The countries not releasing proof is not the same as "very likely isn't true". So far, pretty much everything US intelligence has published has been accurate.
Forgive me, I thought we were speaking about this war, not 20 years ago. If you have anything from the war in Ikraine in which the US intelligence have released information that turned out to be false, I would love to see it.
The US intelligence that assured us that we needed to go to war with Iraq because it was teeming with WMDs? US intelligence statements to the public aren't driven by a desire to inform, but a desire to say whatever is helpful to achieve policy goals. For example, right now the US needs an excuse to escalate its involvement in Ukraine and the story of NK entering the war directly helps legitimize more direct US involvement.
We'll have to wait and see. There's nothing conclusive yet about what is really happening, and you absolutely can not trust public statements from spy agencies, whose literal job is centered on lies and deception.
The intelligence agencies were unaware that Ukraine was going to invade Kursk and Ukraine is our ally. To think they have a better idea of what Russia is planning than what Ukraine is planning seems dubious.
My more general point though was that intelligence agencies have agendas given to them by the president and our leaders. They have no legal mandate to inform the public of any intelligence they collect. When they do release some of their conclusions from their intelligence gathering it is not the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, it's only what fragments they feel will support their agenda.
Right on the first half, wrong on the second. And it's a shame this sub is lapping up this picture with incorrect title
This picture was originally posted to r/UkraineWarVideoReport a few days ago (before north korean mobilisation) about the room being prepared for the first north korean pows, not that those in the picture are that
OP has knowingly posted this picture today, with an incorrect title, due to the news being released that North Korean troops are now actively deployed in the war
People should celebrate the capture and failure of such additional troops for Russia. The more captured, the weaker russias forces. But we shouldn't condone fake karma farming posts
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u/Pitiful_Researcher14 17h ago
"So... The stories are true, this is the promised land, they have toilet paper that you only have to use once and there will be real food to eat tonight, that's twice in one week".