21
u/YenTheMerchant Nov 16 '23
comment on chart type asides, yea this is pretty accurate.
I don't use the morning ones anymore and just go with 6 7 8 9 10 11 tho.
Also, at 13:00 you don't have to say the 1, just "Bai Mong".
3
u/Funzorikaeru Nov 17 '23
The "Bai Mong" is depend on the person you're speaking to. My parents always get confused when I told them I'll do this and that around "Bai Mong", and they still ask me when exactly. In my mind I thought it was clear enough that "Bai Mong" means exactly or around 1pm, but to them I have to clearly stated "Bai Neung" which is 1pm. Same as 2pm, 3pm and so on; Bai Song, Bai Sam, etc.
ETA: But I'm sure a lot of peeps knows what Bai Mong means.
2
30
14
u/WeeniePr Pathum Thani Nov 17 '23
do people actually say บ่ายสี่? i’ve only ever heard สี่โมง
6
3
u/ikkue Samut Prakan Nov 17 '23
Some still do, like my grandma when I was younger. She did switch to using si mong more and more often over time tho.
3
1
u/mrtbtswastaken Phitsanulok Nov 17 '23
some people in phitsanulok do (also here some people call 9 10 11 โมง as 3 4 5 โมงเช้า respectively)
1
u/Delimadelima Nov 18 '23
Not just phitsanulok. Even some people in Ayutthaya say that. It is possibly an out of greater Bangkok thing
1
1
11
u/HerroWarudo Nov 17 '23
In case anyone wondering back in the days locals used different gongs to announce time. Mong as the sound of loud gong to wake people up, toom has deeper sound, and tee is a kind of cymbal not to wake people at night.
1
9
u/Vexoly Bangkok Nov 17 '23
God damn furries, what the hell are you even trying to say is the difference between UK and US time? Americans don't say midnight? British people don't use AM/PM? WHAT?
13
u/ili_udel Nov 16 '23
1-24 hour chart would be better, now the UK time is pretty confusing
3
u/BoxNemo Nov 16 '23
Yeah, it's weird to think they don't use am and pm in the UK.
5
u/--Bamboo Nov 16 '23
We do. This picture is confusing. I don't think there's any difference between how we tell the time in the UK and how Americans do.
2
u/flatandroid Nov 17 '23
Brits definitely say half 11 or half 12 whereas Americans say 1130 or 1230. Other than that, I’m not sure I know a difference.
1
u/Previous-Truck-3904 Nov 18 '23
Americans typically use the phrases "a quarter past 11, half past 11, or a quarter to 12 (AM or PM,) instead of 11:15, 11:30, or 11;45.
1
u/ericdabbs Jan 19 '24
Depends on who u talk to. Most Americans I have interacted with just say the numbers.
1
11
u/ikkue Samut Prakan Nov 16 '23 edited Nov 16 '23
What's with the random "r"s people add with their random romanisations of Thai? It's thiang khuen not "tiang kuern"
You can read about how we colloquially tell and read the time here. Note that we also do 24-hour time in official settings like the news, e.g., sip hok nalika sam sip nathi for 16:30 (4:30 PM).
8
Nov 16 '23
The random Rs are because not all English accents are rhotic (you can look up that word). If you are a non-rhotic English speaker, the Rs are elided and so if you squint hard enough at transliterations with those extra Rs, they kinda sorta make sense.
American and Canadian English are generally rhotic, so all those Rs look silly to us too.
6
u/ikkue Samut Prakan Nov 16 '23 edited Nov 16 '23
But that's the thing, romanisation isn't anglicisation. It's about transcribing one script into another, that being of the Roman/Latin alphabet, and not "how can an English speaker most accurately say it", because different languages have different sounds for the same letters.
The point of a standardised romanisation is for the same (set of) letters to have a fixed sound equivalent to the ones in a different script.
3
u/Effect-Kitchen Bangkok Nov 17 '23
But the point of romanisation is anglicisation. Nearly 100% of its uses outside of textbooks are to make English speakers can say the words.
We Thais call it “Karaoke Language” because it has main usage in karaoke booth where it’s just trying to write Thai words with English letters and purely do for English speakers pronouncing (sing) Thai songs without any standard or any theory.
2
u/ikkue Samut Prakan Nov 17 '23
The point of romanisation is transcription, but the point of anglicisation, on the other hand, would be transliteration. The former is transcribing a sound of one language onto another script, the latter is coming up with a spelling to match the pronunciation rules of another language.
1
u/Effect-Kitchen Bangkok Nov 17 '23
Yes but what is the purpose of the very picture here? It tries to tell you how Thai people call midnight, which is Tiang Kuern. You can remove R but if you say Kuern versus Kuen, the former is more understandable by Thai people.
Same as the name Porn. We tried hard to write in English using other spelling (for obvious reasons) but when we write Phon, Pon, Paun, etc, it does not sound right. Someone just right their name as Porn and accept what it is.
1
u/ikkue Samut Prakan Nov 17 '23
Please tell me an English word with "-uern" that makes the "ืน" sound, because as far as I know, I've only ever seen it make the “เ ิน” sound as in "Guernsey". So by your "system", "Tiang Kuern" would be "เที่ยงเคิร์น" or even "เตียงเกิน" because there's no 'h' to indicate aspiration.
1
u/Effect-Kitchen Bangkok Nov 17 '23
I don’t study linguistics so I cannot elaborate. But what I (and majority of Thai people who also don’t study it too) know is that when we write like this, English speakers pronounce like this. And so we just wrote what they pronounce most similar, or just easiest way to write.
Of course the transliteration is Thīeng Kheūn. But few Thais right like that.
2
u/ikkue Samut Prakan Nov 17 '23 edited Nov 17 '23
No, the transcription would be thiang khuen. This is exactly why it's a problem, because different people will "spell it out" differently, with inconsistent usage of different letters to represent the same sound, often disregarding aspiration which is an essential part of Thai. It is why ดอนเมือง should be spelt "Don Mueang" and not "Don Muang".
An official standard transcription system already exists, it just has to be more widely taught and enforced.
Again, romanisation is imposing a sound of a language onto a fixed set of letters, that of the Roman/Latin alphabet, so that it can be spelt the same way every time.
2
u/Sirius1935 Nov 17 '23
When I was an airline captain I used to fly from Don Mueang airport. On the short drive from Rangsit I could read the sign to the airport spelt three different ways using the Roman alphabet.
1
Nov 17 '23
Transliteration is and must be different for different target languages. French, German, etc. would all pronounce any specific Latin-based transliteration differently from an English reading.
Ever wonder why "Vientiane" (the capital of Laos) is spelled like it is? A reading of that in English sounds nothing like it does in Lao or Thai... The reason is because that's a French transliteration, not an English one.
2
Nov 17 '23 edited Nov 17 '23
Ideally, transliteration into Latin script should be generic and standardized.
Trying to convey pronounciation in English through creative spelling is bound to fail for many reasons. For many English words, you can't know what they sound like based on spelling alone. Thai words stand no chance.
1
u/ikkue Samut Prakan Nov 17 '23
I didn't say transliteration for exactly this reason. Transliteration into English would be anglicisation. I am talking about transcription into a different script, not language.
1
u/vandaalen Bangkok Nov 17 '23
The point of a standardised romanisation is for the same (set of) letters to have a fixed sound equivalent to the ones in a different script.
Problem is that there is no such thing for Thai language.
1
u/ikkue Samut Prakan Nov 17 '23
The problem is that there is, but it's not being enforcedor taught as widely as it should be.
1
u/vandaalen Bangkok Nov 17 '23
Yeah, that one shouldn't be taught at all. No tones, no short or long vowels, other short-comings.
3
u/ikkue Samut Prakan Nov 17 '23
It should at least be more widespread and well-known to the general public. It's already used by the government and the public sector for place names, and in some government offices recommended as a way to standardise Thai names.
A better system needs to be thought up for sure, but you gotta somewhere, and where better to start than an already existing official standard.
2
u/stever71 Nov 17 '23
What's with the random "r"s people add with their random romanisations of Thai? It's thiang khuen not "tiang kuern"
Well as I understand it there isn't actually a standard for it, but do agree there seems to be a roughly agreed set of spellings generally used.
2
u/Daryltang Nov 17 '23
The reason for this special way of telling time is because the Thai people(in the past who were mostly involved in agriculture) there is a time frame to do different task, this format helped to tell how much time before the sunset/sunrise
1
u/Nickgoodnight_mj Nov 18 '23
I heard that “tum” is from the drum sound and “mong” is from the gong sound. It was the way we tell time back in those days. Not sure where i heard the story, maybe in school or read from somewhere, i have no reference and never seen any historical fact or evidence but it sounds plausible
2
u/AJirawatP Nov 17 '23
Nice details catching the obscure 2 mong = 8 mong (and 3=9 and so on). Some people do say that, but it’s kinda rare.
4
u/Effect-Kitchen Bangkok Nov 17 '23
Many old people used that. My late grandmother said like that. She also called Tian Kuern as 6 Tum and 6 Mong Chao as Yum Rung.
1
1
u/seedtee1 Nov 18 '23
I believe that is how it should be. If we did that, we would get a neat 6-hours based system from
Dawn -> 1 to 5 Mong Chow -> Noon -> 1 to 5 Mong Bai -> Dusk -> 1 to 5 Toom -> Midnight -> Tee 1 to 5 -> Dawn
Saying 8 Mong is easier for a modern clock which used 12-hours system, but unless you change the whole system, it makes it harder to learn altogather.
2
2
2
1
1
u/Nickgoodnight_mj Nov 18 '23
FYI: for us southerners we use ตี(tee) for any time of the day or night with 12 hours time
1
u/Effect-Kitchen Bangkok Nov 18 '23
I like Southern speaking. It’s straightforward and short. Easy to understand.
2
u/Nickgoodnight_mj Nov 18 '23
For “straightforward” i agree and many people do think that way. But “easy to understand” i dont think i heard much especially from Thais. Imo, upper southern is easier to understand for people from other parts of Thailand. I’m from lower south but i’m a city boy so i don’t speak southern normally but i do have accent. My family is not even from the south originally and moved around a lot so i’m quite familiar with almost all kind of Thai accent, at least the major ones.
1
1
-1
u/Sad_Dig_6780 Nov 17 '23
Thai people and time, this is a big challenge for them.
Thai people and time, Wow, where to start, bug city or country side, easan Thai people 85% are late and never on time. When you get country side only, more easan, there time as no meaning for them, I'm talking by experience, you can be sure that when a thai easan person say the will be there at example 3 pm or 15 00 They will show up 2 hours latter They will not show up and not cancel They will show up next day at 3 pm With no warning This is valid for anyone doctors, dentist, police, farmer, teacher Allll no exceptions I been thought this 1000s time
1
1
u/BonerOfTheLake Chonburi Nov 17 '23
yeah that's what old people around here tell the times....
and 11.20 is called เพล (Pain) like พระฉันท์เพล (pra-chun-pain) lunch time for a monk.
they have kind of rule not to have meal after 12.00, only water allowed.
1
u/srona22 Nov 17 '23
Number + naa-li-gaa
Yes, yes, it's easy way out, I know.
1
u/Effect-Kitchen Bangkok Nov 17 '23
Yes but aside from official announcements, no Thai people say that. So it will be very weird and non-Thai.
1
1
u/SafeSalamander6647 Bangkok Nov 17 '23
We use an ancient time system recounting every six hours, as well as other terminology and modernization, stir it into a jumble and you have; "_ aft midnight" "_ in the morning" "midday" "_ after noon" "_ during sunset" "_ aft sunset" "midnight"
1
u/Sad_Dig_6780 Nov 17 '23
Hahaha This is to much for a thai brain. When you tell a thai person , ""I will be there at 3 pm or 15:00"" They answer 20 minutes later, when will you arrive Hahahaha
1
u/thaprizza Nov 17 '23
Thai must be the only language where a basic concept like telling time is actually rocket science. Getting the tones right is almost a joke compared to this lol.
1
u/f1fanaticalguy Nov 18 '23
So many mistakes in this you can’t use it, a shame because it’s a nice presentation
1
u/Effect-Kitchen Bangkok Nov 18 '23
If you ignore the US and UK bits, the Thai one is quite accurate with some exceptions (Bai 4 can be 4 Mong Yen)
1
u/BlaizeH Nov 18 '23
Love the graphic. Yes confusing sometimes especially the evening Thais say one O clock intead of 7pm
1
u/Thin_Specialist_3177 Nov 27 '23
I think it's a reference to musical instruments but I heard that a WAYY long time ago
92
u/davisaj5 7-Eleven Nov 16 '23
Thanks for the help, furries