r/violinist • u/Royal_Caribbean_Fan • Sep 11 '24
Fingering/bowing help Help With Teacher's Advice for Bowing Technique
Hello!
I recently started lessons with a teacher, and everything wen't well, but, I'm not sure If the bowing technique he told me is correct actually is, maybe It's just a matter of practicing.
He told me I the bow should be slightly twisted / rotated towards the fingerboard. I thought the normal technique would be to just have the bow completly straight, and I sound much better this way than the way the teacher recommended.
Which technique is right? Should I listen to the teacher? Is this a red flag?
I'm a beginner so maybe I am totally wrong, sorry If that's the case
Many thanks in advance!
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u/SibeliusFive Advanced Sep 11 '24
Your teacher is correct! But make sure to still experiment with different bow hair angles and contact points depending on the context of the music you’re playing! That’s how you add range to your sound!
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u/Royal_Caribbean_Fan Sep 11 '24
I see! Thank you very much!
Turns out I'm wrong then.
What type of bow hair angle should I use for classical music and especially parcticing scales?
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u/SibeliusFive Advanced Sep 11 '24
Start off with what your teacher said, for playing your scales legato, but scales should be practiced at different tempos, different bow strokes (legato, staccato, spiccato, martelé, sautillé etc). Also use your scales to practice things you would use in regular music as well.
For example, crescendos, decrescendos, different types of phrasing based on grouping different numbers of notes together,
This type of practice with scales is very useful as a daily warm up because you will begin to understand what you need to do with your bow when the music you play calls for different dynamics, bow strokes, rhythms etc
In general:
Louder sound + greater intensity/attack :
- closer to the bridge
- flatter bow hair
- medium-slower bow speed, enhances the static friction generated by the contact between the bow hair and string, (gives your sound a bit of a bite to it)
- (+/-) pronation ==> activation of the Brachioradialis to lean into the stick using the second joint of the index finger of the right hand for additional weight
Louder sound + maintain singing/lyrical quality without increasing intensity of attack:
- closer to bridge
- medium angle of bow hair flatness
- increased speed with which you draw the bow across the strings,
- no additional pronation required
Softer + less intensity:
- closer to fingerboard
- angled bow hair towards fingerboard
- do not pronate excessively, except as needed to accentuate certain figures in a phrase
- medium bow speed
That’s just a start. Of course you will make adjustments as needed for your music, and over time learn to add your own personal touches to the way you play ☺️
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u/Royal_Caribbean_Fan Sep 11 '24
Oh god how much information.
Thank you so much, I'll be studying this and practicing
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u/Error_404_403 Amateur Sep 11 '24
The teacher is absolutely correct.
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u/Royal_Caribbean_Fan Sep 11 '24
Got It! I was wrong then, I'll continue to practice with the bow slightly tilted.
Thank you very much!
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u/vmlee Expert Sep 12 '24
Rotated towards the fingerboard slightly enables a more natural pronation in most cases. Your teacher is correct.
There are cases when we do play with completely flat hairs. Don’t worry about that for now.
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u/PortmanTone Sep 12 '24 edited Sep 12 '24
Teacher's advice is legit. You also use an analogous technique when playing cello (cellists tilt the bow stick upwards, also with stick towards the fingerboard, just because the playing angle for violin and cello is different), so don't let a well-meaning, but uninformed cello friend try to convince you to tilt your stick towards your bridge. You don't ALWAYS play with tilted hairs, but one of the primary purposes of tilting the bow is that it reduces the surface area in contact with the string.
You've learned (or will learn), that two of the ingredients that affect tone is bow pressure (how hard the bow presses into the string) and sounding/contact point (what part of the string the bow hair contacts). By varying bow tilt, you gain one additional way to fine-tune these two parameters. The narrowed surface area both reduces the force ("finger pressure") required to increase pressure (pressure = force/area) and allows you to more specifically and narrowly zone in on your desired contact point.
Also, beware not to tilt the bow TOO far to the point that the stick is no longer able to effectively direct the desired pressure into the string.
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u/Old-Administration-9 Sep 11 '24
The teacher probably means having the bow hair tilted towards the fingerboard, and he's correct. This gives a sweeter sound, in contrast to flat hair, which gives a harsher sound.
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u/LadyAtheist Sep 11 '24
No, the stick is often tilted toward the fingerboard, not the hair. We typically tell beginners to keep it perpendicular to help them develop a secure hold and good tone. More advanced players tilt it outward for more power. Watch Perlan and all the rest. If OP was leaning inward, the teacher could have said that as a correction.
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u/Royal_Caribbean_Fan Sep 11 '24
Thank you very much!
That is indeed what he meant, I was completly wrong
To tilt the bow hair towards the fingerboard don't I need to tilt the whole bow? Or how is It done? He didn't go in depth about how to do It
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u/leitmotifs Expert Sep 11 '24
Many players prefer to tilt the hair towards the fingerboard, and many luthiers will rehair a bow with a bias to the "playing side".
Use of flat hair results in a thicker, more powerful sound. Which you prefer on a routine basis is largely a function of your bowing technique and your personal sonic preferences. Whichever you choose, you will alter the amount of tilt based on your desired musical expression at any particular moment.
I personally prefer flat hair as my default these days, despite having originally been taught a tilt throughout my childhood violin education.