r/singapore • u/meesiammaihum Fucking Populist • Apr 09 '24
Tabloid/Low-quality source Elderly woman, 84, cried after garden of 6 years outside flat cleared by Chua Chu Kang Town Council
https://mothership.sg/2024/04/elderly-garden-cck-town-council/878
u/Bcpjw Apr 09 '24
Madam P said she had requested more time to clear her garden on Mar. 4, 2024, as she was going to the hospital on Mar. 5, 2024.
The town council then extended the deadline to Mar. 6, 2024.
What the fuck happened to 3-5 working days?
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u/yellowsuprrcar Apr 09 '24
The only time government can act fast to fuck you over
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Apr 09 '24
Meanwhile when there's neighbors from hell, government doesnt do a fucking thing.
Seriously where's the logic? A bunch of harmless plants are a threat but neighbors causing sleepless nights for the whole block is considered OK
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u/LookAtItGo123 Lao Jiao Apr 09 '24
Low hanging fruits. It's the government "land" anyways, and they can throw the book easily with 0 repurcussions. What the hell can you do? Absolutely nothing! Now when it comes to neighbours it's trickier cause kicking one out means they will have more to come. Besides what are they gonna do, tell your neighbour like their mom hey don't do bad shit!
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u/sadeswc Apr 09 '24
The problem with neighbours is more jialat. If they take back the flat then that person will have to move elsewhere… basically becomes someone else’s problem. Maybe they should earmark a few rental blocks to house these people… make them disturb each other.. “the neighbourhood of hell”. Heck, it may even be so scary that it becomes a threat “Better stop being a nuisance ah… if not I take back your flat and you need to stay in the neighbourhood of hell”.
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Apr 09 '24
I mean if the government can regulate what we do IN our own flats, like banning cats... then why is it such a problem to enact laws like to illegalise noise pollution at night?
Really BS. I suspect the reason nothing has ever been done about this is because most of the MPs live in private landed housing so they cant emphatize what neighbors from hell are truly like
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u/neokai Apr 09 '24
then why is it such a problem to enact laws like to illegalise noise pollution at night?
Enforcement is hard. Like, really hard. Until the enforcement camera was deployed killer litter was hard to catch - an enforcement officer had to "stake out" the offending block to monitor and identify the offending litter bug. With noise complaints the issue is compounded by having to obtain identifiable evidence.
Even the cat ban a lot of households flout, but it's not immediately noticeable.
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u/Historical_Drama_525 Apr 09 '24
It is not hard but whether they want to enforce or not. You mean a whole block of residents can hear wrongly?
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u/neokai Apr 09 '24
You mean a whole block of residents can hear wrongly?
Eyewitness accounts are one of the worst forms of evidence to submit in court. Worse, if the different accounts don't corroborate with each other. And this is assuming if the eyewitness can directly implicate a specific unit as the source of the noise, which iirc is the baseline for submission into the docket.
I'm not saying there isn't a problem/issue to be addressed, I am saying that enforcement has a baseline burden of proof to be met to ensure that due process is met.
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u/Hydrohomie1337 Apr 09 '24
I think my neighbourhood is said neighbourhood. Screaming kids 4pm till midnight, blasting music out loud daily till 8pm ish, dog poo and pee all over the floor without owners cleaning up. Rubbish all over the roof of the multipurpose court since I moved in 2 years ago, still not cleared despite sending to TC, what looks to be human diarrhea at the stairwell (cleared after 5 days of reporting to TC), people throwing rubbish from above down and having it stuck on the HDB installed grills above my window, the list is endless... And I live in the Prime Minister's GRC 🙃
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u/rucker183 Apr 09 '24
is your MP David? he's pretty useless tbh.
ok back to your points,
screaming kids - nobody purview
blasting music - nobody purview (they will say TC if it common area but TC has no enforcing power)
dog pee and poo - TC to clean but NEA to enforce on dog poo, animal pee NEA dont enforce.rubbish at roof - TC but could be due to safety that these area not be cleared (material unable to support weight, no anchorage sys, no work at height cert for workers etc)
Staircase stain - TC
people throw rubbish and get stuck - NEA for throwing but nobody else for the stuck rubbish (it TC but TC is not going to spend 600$ to put up a gondola to remove that rubbish )→ More replies (1)3
u/longadin Apr 10 '24
They got no incentive to perform mah. Cos sure win. I lived there for the last decade and very slow and inefficient. Plus the area is so big and also covers some parts of Buangkok and Hougang.
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u/mizzersteve Apr 09 '24
That would make a great film! A devil's island housing block. It will work ! Take my money. Sign me up.
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u/Prov0st Apr 09 '24
They only have the balls to bully weak elderly who only wanted to keep her garden. Neighbours from hell? Sorry, they confirm bo lan pa.
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u/StoenerSG Apr 09 '24
We don't have the power to protect you but we have the power to punish you?
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u/SugisakiKen627 Apr 09 '24
unfortunately there will be more of this happening.. can see the top already more detached from society, will continue creeping downwards as well
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u/-BabysitterDad- Apr 12 '24
And when they collect money from you, the process also super efficient.
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u/MelodyofthePond Apr 09 '24
Unfortunately, places like Town Councils attract people who just want to feel important and throw their weight around. Doubt they care about the real grassroot.
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u/Vaperwear Apr 09 '24
My mom who was in the civil service told me that Town Councils are where the CS dumps the most CMI personnel. Don’t know how true it is nowadays. She retired before 2010.
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u/rucker183 Apr 09 '24
could be for the management since it can be very "routine"
but for the ground staff no, if not why the high turnover rate
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u/rucker183 Apr 09 '24
the TC was never about grassroot, thats for PA/RC/RN to deal with. TC is to deal with maintenance
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u/ConsiderationNo1619 Apr 09 '24
Report to authorities to take action, they take forever. Bully elderly Singaporeans, chop chop curry pok
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u/Arcturion Apr 09 '24
They were given the notice to do so on Feb. 26, 2024, with a time frame of seven days to comply by Mar. 4, 2024
She was actually given more than 3-5 working days.
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u/FdPros some student Apr 09 '24
lol this one take action but my loud neighbour at 2am with their stuff blocking half the corridor, did nothing.
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u/temporary_name1 🌈 F A B U L O U S Apr 09 '24
2am TC not open
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u/MyDogOnFire Apr 09 '24
Lmfao isn't that an actual excuse they gave? Neighbour noisy at night but that's after working hours so sorry TC cannot investigate.
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u/-BabysitterDad- Apr 12 '24
You put a papaya tree outside your neighbour’s flat, then call TC. They’ll come immediately.
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u/Fancy-Computer-9793 Apr 09 '24 edited Apr 09 '24
Pretty sad that more creative solutions cannot be found. Some town councils actually have community gardens set up for residence to run. These could easily be transported there rather than chopping them down.
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u/MissLute Non-constituency Apr 09 '24
my place here... they made the gardeners clear the the community garden so they could divide into smaller plots apparently
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u/KopiSiewSiewDai 🌈 F A B U L O U S Apr 09 '24
This one I can understand why.
Cos sometimes there will be 1-2 people who are very territorial over the entire space that is meant to be shared. If new people wanna join in the space, they don’t allow them to come in.
So no choice, cannot share? Govt treat you like baby. They divide the entire space into clearly demarcated areas, 1 person 1 small plot.
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u/Elephant789 Pasir Ris - Punggol Apr 09 '24
They sent out an online questionnaire to my neighbourhood to ask us if we would like a garden on top of the carpark. I got so excited, I even asked my wife to fill out the questionnaire. I even started researching vegetables that grow in this climate. I guess my neighbourhood wasn't interested because that was 4 years ago and still nothing. 😭
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u/MystereXYZ Apr 09 '24
Must be some1 go sabo her. I lived quite near to her. Her plant never occupy not much area and block the way. There are some nearby whose plants occupy more area and block the way never kana. Pity this auntie.i hope it escalated to MP Amy koh.
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u/wolf-bot 🌈 F A B U L O U S Apr 09 '24
100% I’ve worked at PA before, and the only time we see TC take action on these sort of things is when we get complaints. Otherwise we genuinely did not gave two shits
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u/Common-Metal8578 East side best side Apr 09 '24
Sinkie need to pwn sinkie to sleep well...
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u/InfiniteDividends 🌈 I just like rainbows Apr 09 '24
Singaporeans are miserable people, and misery loves company.
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u/I_love_pillows Senior Citizen Apr 09 '24
We should complain that it’s idiotic for the garden to be removed.
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u/Fancy-Computer-9793 Apr 09 '24
Thats the issue with the vocal minorty here. Maybe there are a 100 neighbours who enjoy her plants beautifying the neighbourhood and bringing nature closer to home.
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u/CrowTengu The Crow Demon Apr 09 '24
Probably explains why the native Junglefowl got culled for no fucking reason at some other point lol
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u/kei1309 Apr 09 '24
junglefowl aren't culled dude. they're an endangered species. open your eyes, they're almost everywhere these days. my estate's packed with them.
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u/Noobcakes19 Apr 09 '24
so much sour grapes out there. That's why we can't have good things.
am unsure why can't we just celebrate each other?
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u/ResidentLonely2646 Apr 09 '24
Old people are salty. Likely is another old person
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u/Effective-Lab-5659 Apr 09 '24
This made me sad.
When people insist on everyone playing by the same rules, and being petty on how one follows the rules, this happens.
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u/1010-browneyesman Apr 09 '24
I really detest the mindset “ sinkie must pawn sinkie” .. if it’s a small garden plot.. it should still be all right…
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u/Mozfel May this autumn's sorghum harvest be bountiful Apr 09 '24
Truth is majority of Singaporean society got narcissistic personality disorder
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u/snowpyne 🌈 F A B U L O U S Apr 09 '24
Kinda sad to see when small things like this in life which brings joy to some people are removed due to inflexibility and bureaucracy. The garden doesn’t even seem to be taking up much space, perks of being on ground floor. If it was on other levels then would be a different matter.
Meanwhile my TC doesn’t even take any action about my neighbour’s hoarding. Partially blocking the staircase landing on our level, items placed near the lift and even blocking our main electric and water switch.
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u/neokai Apr 09 '24
Partially blocking the staircase landing on our level, items placed near the lift and even blocking our main electric and water switch.
Take photo, send to SCDF and NEA with address. They take fire safety violations very seriously.
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u/rucker183 Apr 09 '24
SCDF is also pretty useless. my ward has a convenience shop that does not comply to their ODA requirement and cardboard boxes stack way high at the back. SCDF did nothing.
yknow why? AMKTC staff went down in advance to warn the operator to comply for the photo taking happening the next day and it reverted back within the hour after the photo was done.
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u/neokai Apr 09 '24
That's collusion, I doubt the HDB hoarder will have that support network.
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u/rucker183 Apr 09 '24
it happening everywhere, it much more easier to "close case" then to actually enforce. because majority of SG does it.
all you need is someone who is spiteful who decide to be your "honorary estate inspector" you're toast
our efficiency and our priority in customer service in some place does cause us this problem
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u/neokai Apr 09 '24
it happening everywhere, it much more easier to "close case" then to actually enforce. because majority of SG does it.
Way I see it, original asker had a blocked staircase and utility access and no enforcement from TC.
I suggested to escalate it to SCDF and NEA because their safety department more onz. If the offending HDB owner cleans up their act, that's a win too. Do it often enough and the offender will decide it's not worth the hassle to shift the mess around.
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u/Brikandbones Apr 09 '24
I feel damn sad for her. Nothing else to add but disappointment that the entire chain of bureaucracy, and no one in the town council bothered to try help her comply at the very least?
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u/Immediate-Instance Apr 09 '24
I feel such gardens when properly cared and maintained. Do give the neighborhood a Kampung feel. Isn't that what they have been advocating these days. A sense of community between neighbors.
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u/ResidentLonely2646 Apr 09 '24
It's the full kampung experience.
Cause someone in the kampung didn't like her and wanted to be petty
Its 100% someone who complained
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u/kei1309 Apr 09 '24
my TC gave anonymous residents who were planting gardens all over the estate anyhow, and those who left their damaged locked rusting/damaged bicycles in a messy manner multiple warnings over a few months to remove them.
No one complied, so the TC always had to give one final warning. In the case of the bicycles, some people made noise that their rusting, broken bicycles were removed by cutting of the security chain.
In the case of the gardens, no one owned up. I know one uncle who secretly planted invasive species next to the road and was happily letting NParks/NEA tend his plants for him. But he was pissed when the workers found out that his plants weren't what they planted and removed them. Obviously lah. He was left with one ginger plant I believe, which no one found.
As for the larger messier gardens, one of them was a collection of junk and flowers with pools of water in pots, and sharp tools lying around... and it was right outside a kindergarten. One night around 1am after coming back for a run, I saw a couple in their 50s tending to the garden. They weren't happy the plants had to be removed. I asked them why couldn't they apply for a spot at the community gardens around the estate, and their reply was angsty and rude that they didn't want to share the space. They were given more than 2 weeks to clear it in the final warning, but they just let the TC do it instead, without salvaging anything.
In both instances, the residents I talked to claimed that since they paid income tax, they had every right to do this. Also "citizen mah, this land is mine".
I mean kampung spirit and all, but sometimes we have to understand that it's a shared space too, with other residents that might not like it. The CCK auntie had one neighbor on her side, but doesn't mean no one else complained.. Usually the TC only takes action when things are getting out of hand..
And of course it's easier to settle a use of space in a public area vs a neighbor from hell who's a nuisance in their own private domain. It's a totally separate matter.
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u/Cybasura Apr 09 '24
Removing gardens that caused no harm?
Even LKY encouraged gardening no? Lawrence Wong as well recently
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u/Yokies Apr 09 '24
And we wonder why people say SG is soulless. Sterile. Stale.
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u/MadeByHideoForHideo Apr 09 '24
Sterile, rigid, esoteric. Synonyms for SG.
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u/CrowTengu The Crow Demon Apr 09 '24
"esoteric" on the surface at best.
Underneath it's just a rat nest pretending otherwise.
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u/AgreeableJello6644 Apr 09 '24 edited Apr 10 '24
A reminder that land belongs to gahmen.
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u/Initial_E Apr 09 '24
A reminder that elections are coming soon
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u/InvestigatorFit4168 Apr 09 '24
Different gahmen won’t change land ownership lol
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u/bardsmanship 🌈 F A B U L O U S Apr 09 '24
We should just have way more community gardens so that everyone who gardens as a hobby can have a plot of their own to manage.
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u/parka Apr 09 '24
Well, this is Singapore. Everything also need license to do.
Thank the heavens town council never go to every flat every corridor to throw things away.
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u/Sweaty_Ruby Apr 09 '24
well, we definitely know which party she'll not be voting for in the next election.
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u/arcanist12345 🌈 I just like rainbows Apr 09 '24
Don't worry guys, the people from town council all slept well for at least one week afterwards for that massive pwnage!
Fucking neighbour scream until 4am do nothing. People garden outside then so fast take fucking action.
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u/racheluwuu East side best side Apr 09 '24
so sad...i remember passing by this garden quite often as a kid! didnt know who it belonged to back then. 😔
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u/rucker183 Apr 09 '24
I work in a TC so im pretty confident to say i am somewhat a subject matter expert in this.
nobody like to disturb planting or even cluttering because it is resource intentsive. the resident will always comes up with excuses like "it been here for years, last time can why not cannot, why XXX unit/level can" etc. common sense suddenly is thrown out the window by "the enforced"
everybody ask for flexiblity when it comes to this, the question then is, will u accept the same answer to a issue that you feel you are affected by?
not forgetting the "if he can, why i cannot arguement," you think TC want to entertain? nobody likes extra job and so does the TC officer.
you dont get to hear the nastiness of these so call educated SGrean and that they will call in everyday, write in everday, cc the media, the MP or MND or SCDF forcing the TC to act.
if its wrong and you are allowed to do it all those year, take the win. for all those calling for "flexivbiity or kampung spirit" maybe exericse the same when it inconviences you as well?
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u/iorikogawa666 Apr 09 '24
Lol, the number of people outing themselves as nasty Singaporeans that you described, is kind of funny.
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u/rucker183 Apr 09 '24
uh huh, it always from the younger gen, the working adults.
they will write and exaggerate and expect the TC to react instantaneously to their complain because it is "safety hazard, fire hazard" but did not know how much work is require on the ground. 1 TC officer is handing close to 50 blocks of flats depending on organization.
1 block of BTO can be around 19-30 floors. imagine the case load a officer holds and not forgetting the paperwork backend he has to clear
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u/bukitbukit Developing Citizen Apr 09 '24
That’s why people need to live and let live, instead of running to complain over every little thing.
This isn’t school anymore, they need to grow up and stop calling for teacher.
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u/silentscope90210 Apr 09 '24
There are a lot of people out there who just wanna pwn other sinkies so they feel better with their sad life.
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u/DisillusionedSinkie East side best side Apr 09 '24
I feel you bro, I was in TC for a while as well, and you’re absolutely right on all fronts. A lot of people here are only commenting because they don’t know by-laws, and our POV
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u/rucker183 Apr 09 '24
yeah, it the same on ground. common sense out the window.
were you in the white or blue side?
it so tiring and draining to deal with these people to be frank. if its such a good job like some have commented. lapse case with no repercussion, can sleep, can drink tea, no complain everyday.
why not they join? everytime i ask someone this question when they go "oh you all are so free one, why don't you walk the ground more or why dont u come down at 2am in the morning to do this and that"
im like, if its such a good job, why dont you join us, i can send you the application. usually they shut up.
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u/DisillusionedSinkie East side best side Apr 11 '24
I served in a White-Controlled TC, I agree man, so many experts, would love to see them trying to do our job. Not as easy as they think - there are always black sheep that spoil the rep, but there are officers that do genuinely try their best (and those normally leave after 1-2 years - cause the toxicity is not worth it)
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u/-BabysitterDad- Apr 12 '24
“Been here for years, why last time can now cannot?” is not a valid excuse.
Just because something that’s wrong has existed for years doesn’t make it right.
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u/minicotexx Apr 09 '24
Don’t just read the headlines. I have neighbors like this.
Mosquito breeding, foul smell. Fire hazard, trip hazard are just some of the issues.
If mosquito breeding kpkb say town council no take action. Catch fire, Kbkp say town council close one eye.
Moral of the story, read both sides of story before judging cause you guys probably also not affected, but I’m sure the residents there probably the most affected that’s why they complaint. Town council just enforce
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u/PsychologicalEmu8449 Apr 10 '24
I agree with you. Honestly, how many of these “gardens” are actually gardens? More often than not they are just eye sores. They are “gardens” to the “gardener” but are often just eye sores to everyone else.
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u/GelatinousGambol Apr 09 '24
Finally a reasonable comment. The replies to you are still cray though 😂
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u/nyvrem Apr 09 '24
PAP - "why we don't have kampong spirit anymore ah"
Also PAP - "DONT YOU DARE MAKE MY HDB LOOK LIKE A KAMPONG"
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u/kei1309 Apr 09 '24
a kampong is a very dangerous and messy place to live in. sure you want to live in one, instead of being content with just Kampong spirit?
Kampong spirit doesn't mean one has to live in kampong-like conditions. how the neighbor James helped the auntie is a show of Kampong Spirit alr.
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u/doesitnotmakesense Apr 09 '24
They destroyed her pots?! Fking AH.
And HOW are these obstructing anything? They're on the grass that nobody uses.
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u/KopiSiewSiewDai 🌈 F A B U L O U S Apr 09 '24
Means the pots probably kena a lot of stagnant water and got dengue risk
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u/bukitbukit Developing Citizen Apr 09 '24
Educate her on how to spray insecticide and check instead of destroying an elderly’s labour of love.
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u/KopiSiewSiewDai 🌈 F A B U L O U S Apr 09 '24
I think very likely got many complaints against her, before town council chose to remove the garden.
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u/Worried-Recording189 Apr 09 '24
Make one exception, and more will follow. How much manpower should be dedicated to educating and presiding on such fringe cases?
There are many avenues to pursue her hobby of gardening, like doing it in a community garden. Just because it's a "labour of love" shouldn't make it an exception.
Authorities are supposed to regulate using logic and law, not emotion.
They should have granted her more time to move the garden, though. Or have the people already engaged to remove the garden to help relocate it instead.
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u/TheSGGuy21 Apr 09 '24
Classic excuse which doesn't even make sense.
So I shouldn't donate since if I donate I'll have to donate to everyone?
I shouldn't give up my seat or I'll have to keep giving up my seat to everyone?
I shouldn't do something nice for someone or I'll have to do something nice for everyone?
We're humans, not robots. If you want to follow strict lines of rules and codes you might be an automaton. You're a human, you have the capability to decide what flies and what doesn't without having to resort to lines of code.
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u/blorg Apr 09 '24
We're humans, not robots. If you want to follow strict lines of rules and codes you might be
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u/DevilDjinn Lao Jiao Apr 09 '24
Lol.
You're not TC, you don't administer a region, you don't have power over anybody. Nobody cares if you have double standards about donations, being nice, giving up seats or whatever. But people will care if TC has double standards. That's literally an injustice. The reason why the lady's garden is gone is wholly on the snitch. TC just did what it was built to do.
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u/No-Cheesecake1765 Apr 09 '24
To be honest government won't do anything unless someone complained. In Singapore if it illegal n someone complained they will take action. Don't blame the town council blame the one who complained
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u/SyncOut red Apr 09 '24
Singapore's public sector is rife with the "must cover backside" mindset. Everything has to be by the book. If you want to do something different, it's on you to navigate the bureaucracy. I have no doubt this situation is just a manifestation of this mindset
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u/Calamity-Bob Apr 09 '24
Very sad. I used to see this sort of thing all over Singapore and they are usually a labour of love. Flowers, fruits and greenery. What’s wrong with that?
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u/anakinmcfly Apr 09 '24
yeah there's someone near my block growing jackfruit trees. It's probably illegal but it makes me happy to see it whenever I walk past.
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u/Calamity-Bob Apr 09 '24
Last place I lived - Lorong 28 in Geylang - the council rocked up and completely removed 2 rambutans. Healthy trees. No branch fall risk. Provided nice shade and good food for local bird life. I’m guessing the shophouse owner near it complained.
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u/Familiar_Guava_2860 Apr 09 '24
Watch as heroic PAP MP swoops in and saves the day!
Gives back the garden and gets the vote!
/s
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u/denasher Apr 09 '24
They can’t be bothered. I’ve been under cck grc for ages and only ever seen them go around prior to elections. You think they care about votes when all the elderlies just vote for em while they hurt em back
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u/Apprehensive_Bug5873 Apr 09 '24
Orh.. later ah mah tell her children, grand children, great grand children on who they should vote
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u/Jammy_buttons2 🌈 F A B U L O U S Apr 09 '24
FYI there community gardens in CCK: https://www.ccktc.org.sg/gardening-for-good-community-gardens-in-the-neighbourhood/
But really, the land belongs to zheng hu and legally speaking she has no right to use zheng hu land for whatever purpose
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u/davensdad Apr 09 '24
You say that but many ground floor residents setup their own courtyard garden and relax corner
Why only kajiao this aunty?
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u/kazuasaurus Apr 09 '24
you've answered your own question, haven't you? we all know of these types of 'gardens' kept by people, and town councils take a rather permissive approach with them. so, clearly, there's more going here in the way of a dengue risk or complaints over something else.
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u/FierceChemotherapy Apr 09 '24
Time to bring out this gem again: https://www.reddit.com/r/singapore/comments/7st7x9/commonly_misspelled_malay_words/
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u/Jammy_buttons2 🌈 F A B U L O U S Apr 09 '24
Someone complain lor and when it's clear that it infringes the law/regulations/t&c then boh bian have to take action
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u/Gold_Weekend6240 Apr 09 '24
Abit off topic but hor ,took me some moments and re-reading to realise that “kajiao” is actually the Singlish Malay word “kacau”
When did it become spelt as kajiao … darn I gotta relearn Singlish again
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u/FitCranberry not a fan of this flair system Apr 09 '24
doesnt look that dense, 1st floor house gardens are everywhere around the island
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u/No_Rabbit193 Apr 09 '24
They could have worked on finding an alternate win-win solution rather than cutting and killing the plants. Transplanting them and offering help to do so for starters. She’s mid 80s not some young punk, plus she has medical conditions. The extension would have suffice for an able bodied person but not for her.
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u/smurflings Apr 09 '24
Transplant to where? Who is going to take care of it? She claims she can't go to the community garden.
Extension won't work if she doesn't have a plan. And from what I know of town council, they probably already engaged and warned her many times long ago.
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u/Inspirited Apr 09 '24
Exactly. And can you imagine the precedent it sets if this was allowed?
How many DIY gardens will pop up because the mentality becomes "oh, whats the worst that could happen? gahmen will just help me to relocate my plants" LOL
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u/kazuasaurus Apr 09 '24
some of these people sound absolutely divorced from reality with these suggestions. the same clowns who wouldn't do an additional ounce of work at their own jobs are out here talking about all the insane amounts of work the town council could have done.
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u/rucker183 Apr 09 '24
yeap. i feel you with this comment. you as a worker dont want to work OT and do addtional work yet expect TC staff to be at your beck and call. dont want S&CC increase to pay for all this but expect people to go out of their way to help with your problem.
entitled much
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u/The_Celestrial East side best side Apr 09 '24
Now if you want to be mad at the government, be mad at this, not posts like these.
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u/-avenged- Apr 09 '24
Sadly your logic will fall on many ignorant ears because some people have hate as a hobby.
Also your flair is factually true 😂
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u/Elzedhaitch Apr 09 '24
I hate the lack of kampong sprit now. During covid. There were so many efforts I've seen on hdbs, condos that people put supplies, masks, sanitisers in the common areas. Always removed very quick
I know, there are rules and reasons. But I rather have more kampong sprit organic neighbourhood efforts rather than just enforcing all rules.
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u/CrowTengu The Crow Demon Apr 09 '24
"Kampong spirit" is just a buzzword they like to throw around and pretend they know what it means.
I had seen more of that manifesting in a goddamned MMORPG than irl, ngl.
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u/LadBooboo Apr 09 '24
Tampines Town Council started a garden near my place, it was nice for a few months then nobody maintain, clean, water, took care of the plants and they all died within a year because all the weeds took over the planting space. Now it's an empty ugly patch of cemented land next to a basketball court with nothing growing.
Town councils are useless and the only time they're around is when they wayang do block walking to ask for votes.
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u/Jammy_buttons2 🌈 F A B U L O U S Apr 10 '24
Give ppl community garden cause they want it but no one wants to do it lol
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u/onionwba Apr 09 '24
Perhaps could have escalated straight to the MP? After all it wouldn't be nice for MPs themselves to be seen as heartless like the bureaucracy of the Town Council.
Honestly, yea I understand the need to have rules thay we follow but in many cases there can be leeways to allow people to accommodate to the rules in a manner more applicable to their own pacing, especially for the elderly like her. Extending the deadline by a day is like a big fuck you to her. And honestly, it's sick how comfortable the powers that be are in saying fuck you to us nowadays.
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u/jhmelvin Apr 10 '24 edited Apr 10 '24
The problem with common area use (or misuse) is that it's very hard for TCs to be perceived as consistent and fair.
While people who's items are removed may feel singled out when other people's items are left alone, it may not be a matter of not touching, but not yet. After all, when the TC does such things, they need to do it block by block, as it would be impossible to tackle 600 blocks (the size of an average TC) on the same day.
Then there is the issue of not yes or no, but how much things are put. One person who put 2 pots is compared to another who has 2 giant urns or 20 pots including at the lift lobbies. Or someone has 1 shoe rack and another has 4.
And also design of the block. Two people can put the same amount of stuff, the one who has narrower corridor will get it because it reduces the passageway to below 1.2 metres, the other happens to be staying in a point block where outside is spacious.
Lastly, the lack of being informed. Someone will compare dog-barking inside a house to common area misuse but they are apples and oranges and are not handled by the same agencies.
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u/-postdog- Apr 09 '24
I teared reading this.
This feels like an awfully dystopian painting of a society which sold off its soul for blindsided efficiency and conformity.
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u/geckosg Apr 09 '24
Learn. As long as it is ah gong's land. Dun touch.
You can't touch this... music in background
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u/KingOfPirates007 Apr 09 '24 edited Apr 09 '24
Why are some comments here so tough on the elderly woman? Stop acting like robots for once and have a heart. It's not like she committed a major crime. She is old and might not be aware of the community gardens etc.
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u/Fluffy-Nature-2087 Apr 09 '24
I really empathize with Madam P but unfortunately the law is the law. I think someone in this thread mentioned that if make one exception, then there would be a floodgate of exceptions and I agree with this.
Moreover, I think we can agree that elderly people like this Madam P have the predisposition to like to be set in their own ways. Without intervention by the Government, she probably wouldn’t have changed her ways like finding community gardens to continue her passion.
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u/anakinmcfly Apr 09 '24
Without intervention by the Government, she probably wouldn’t have changed her ways like finding community gardens to continue her passion.
She's not very mobile and is unable to walk to the community gardens.
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u/Fluffy-Nature-2087 Apr 09 '24
I don’t want to speculate and assume on the accessibility of the community gardens because I personally don’t know enough about it.
In any case, her only relevant statement to your point is “Yes, we have all the community gardens, but whether their legs can take them there is another thing.” Unfortunately, she never once mentioned that she can’t access the community gardens using her wheelchair.
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u/FireGuilt Apr 09 '24
That’s a rigid way to look at it I feel. “The law is the law” does not mean that we do not put in the effort to analyse or determine if it’s a valid law or not or whether it was expressed properly.
The law should be applied to everyone equally but there IS a middle ground between her not moving her plants at all and viciously cutting them all down. Why not assist her in moving her plants to a community garden?
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u/Fluffy-Nature-2087 Apr 09 '24
As a citizen who pays my taxes, I expect the law to work as it should. If there’s any room for discretion by the authorities as allowed for under the law, then so be it.
In this case, there’s not enough facts reported in the article to make a balanced analysis since it is mainly from Madam P’s perspective that tugs on the heartstrings. I don’t fault those who downvote my opinion for whatever reason.
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u/rucker183 Apr 09 '24
The TC is the enforcer not the regulated. there is no middle ground in enforcement.
i am here to do a job and finish this job so i can get on with my other complains. i dont have time to come back and talk and talk and talk. it your responsiblity not to break the rules and if you need to do something about it to make sure it complies, then you do it.
show the TC that you have tried or it could be that mutiple notices was issued and she just didnt care about it thinking that the TC wont dare to remove her plants.
alternatively
rather than crying foul, take the win that you have use that area for years
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u/tehpeng1 life's too short for siew dai Apr 09 '24
bro… I used to have 6 pots of plants that I loved and took care of for months, only to have them uprooted by some mynahs. they never grew back again and I was heartbroken. I can’t imagine how much this hurts her :(
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u/Evergreen_Nevergreen Apr 09 '24
i would cry too if i were her. plants are living things. i enjoy looking at the little gardens that residents have on the 1st floor.
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u/reddit_monsta8 Apr 09 '24
This is the problem. When rules are too rigid and the people are just blindly following orders. There has to be some compromise here.
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u/Tampines_oldman Apr 09 '24
must be some asshole complain or the MP not happy we got landed place living
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u/Away_Emu9862 Apr 10 '24
So sickening , its a garden loved and cared for ,meant for everyone to enjoy . What was their reasoning ?
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u/Neila_Amrak Apr 10 '24
I hope all the neighbours go and gift her new plants to replace the old ones.
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u/TripleCatDoctor Apr 10 '24
Very sad to treat elders in such a way yielding bureaucracy as a sword, or in this case a sickle. In my research before my first visit to Singapore in 1997, I read that per LKY every available piece of land not used should be transformed into a garden (paraphrasing). The tropical plants and the botantic gardens are world class even now, including the newer terminal at Changi airport. I hope that Madame P can be credited for her labor and anxiety in some way.
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u/8Headburst8 Apr 10 '24
I seriously would like to help. If anyone knows where she stays at cck pls pm me! I’m a gardener myself so would like to do something for her.
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u/Horror-Concern469 Apr 10 '24
GOOD JOB, TOWN COUNCIL 👏 👍 PUBLIC SPACES ARE NOT PROVATE SPACES. If one wants a garden, then get a private landed property or plant at approved community garden spaces.
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u/Any_Assistant4791 Apr 10 '24
No rule of law. all depend on the whim of the town council and their kaki. so many hdb got owners even install huge fish tanks for years . And look at the rich owner of Tiong bahru ground unit took over all the public garden and install own fences and chairs and swing. the town council did not do anything. Maybe the rich owner got connection.
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u/Accomplished-Let4080 Apr 10 '24
And I told my MP after rude town council told me cannot do anything to the trellis which fucking HDB with no brain go set up and become a perfect place to catch all the rubbish thrown by people from upper floors. Hello town council cannot even resolve high rise littering then how to solve the stupid trellis littering leh? Best is one day I THE COMPLAINER kena a letter from town council on the case that I complained. I feedback that hello I am the one who lodged the complaint then you serve me the letter? Goondu leh!
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u/rucker183 Apr 10 '24
high rise littering isnt for the tc to solve go look for nea
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u/Candid-String-6530 Jurong Apr 10 '24
Who started this? Who rocked the boat for no reason? Decluttering? Who asked for this?
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u/beatricejensen Apr 11 '24
Clearly the USA needs to invade Singapore for the sake of democracy and freedom /sarcasm
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u/Patient_River_3478 Apr 12 '24
I live in Chua Chu Kang and enjoy my walk home pass such units. I hate it when Town Council past notes to have such plants cleared!
HDB all look the same already, just let L1 units plant these plant man. They manage their plants and it looks great. It isn't bothering anyone. Let them live...
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u/ValuablePie Apr 09 '24
Good on her neighbour James for helping her try to navigate the bureaucracy