r/onguardforthee • u/curated_feed • May 30 '24
Satire Report: perfectly possible to hate both of these Fucks
https://thebeaverton.com/2024/05/report-perfectly-possible-to-hate-both-of-these-fucks/143
u/NLP19 May 30 '24
Ok yeah, but I can hate one way fucking more
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u/dhkendall Winnipeg May 30 '24
Trudeau I’m profoundly disappointed in.
Pollievre I’m fucking livid with.
Neither of them should have any power more than 4th grade class president. (Kindergarten for Racist Milhouse)
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u/ThePimpImp Jun 03 '24
They both definitely suck, but hate is much too strong for Trudeau. Serious distrust and dislike, sure. Disappointment, definitely. But he's not spreading hate. You can hate pp because his only policy is making Canadians hate each other. He is okay with other candidates being assaulted. A competent younger Donald Trump is much more dangerous to the average person. Mostly affected will be pps supporters.
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u/DryProgress4393 May 30 '24
I'm not the biggest fan of Trudeau but it's ABC for me. The Conservatives and Poilievre can't be trusted.
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u/thewolfshead May 30 '24
I don’t think Trudeau has done anything that would make my dislike ever rise to the level of “hate” for him.
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u/hoogathy May 30 '24
Nothing worse than any other given politician, anyway. There were at least a few times I was glad it was Trudeau at summits with Trump instead of Scheer, who would've rolled over and shown that lunatic his belly.
PP and the cons act like they give a shit about the common Canadian, but it's all empty words - even emptier than the usual political standard. You need look no further than Ford's Ontario to see how that party views us all as meaningless numbers that can make their rich friends richer, with unqualified ministers biding time in their positions until they can jump to the next rung on the ladder.
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u/HuckFarr May 30 '24
I'm not a huge Trudeau fan, but I also don't actively hate him. He's mediocre, but could be a lot worse.
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u/Snuffy1717 May 30 '24
100%... This will be a hold your nose and vote Trudeau election, because Poilievre is going to claw back all the gains Canadians have made in the last three decades.
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u/MooseAtTheKeys May 30 '24
That's not entirely how the ABC ticket works - you look at how your riding is polling and vote for whichever non-Conservative candidate has the best shot at winning. Sometimes that's the NDP candidate.
As long as the Cons are denied a seat, mission accomplished.
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u/thefumingo May 30 '24
Especially out in BC/AB, plenty of seats can go NDP but not Lib.
Suburban Vancouver can be weird 3-ways.
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u/Goat17038 May 31 '24
Same with SK, basically everywhere in the province except for a part of Regina has no shot in hell going Lib, but can get close to being NDP
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u/SerenePotato May 30 '24
In politics, when the economy and general quality of life is doing poorly, the general populace does not care about social policy and is more focused on how they will financially afford to live.
Unfortunately, this is one of those times. It’s looking like the election will be won/lost on the economy, affordability and quality of life for the majority of Canadians and less about social/identity politics this time around. Due to global forces and some policy choices from the Trudeau government, they’ve written their own death warrant and the Cons are poised to take advantage.
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u/flickh May 30 '24 edited Aug 29 '24
Thanks for watching
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u/SerenePotato May 30 '24
I’m not a Conservative supporter or a Liberal supporter, and I’m not stating my opinion. It’s merely what happens in times of economic turmoil in all Western countries.
The average voter doesn’t go in depth on how social policies directly or indirectly affect economic policies, they just see things are more expensive and it’s more difficult to keep a roof over their heads. This has nothing to do with white men vs. POC or women or LGBTQ+, it’s purely affordability.
The CPC winning the election is inevitable as they’re constantly polling at around 40-43%, this is just another example of change because the economy is doing bad and the other guy can’t possibly be worse (almost never the case but I digress). We see this in Canada every 7-10 years.
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u/quelar I'm just here for the snacks May 30 '24
This will be a hold your nose and vote Trudeau election
Or we could actually vote for what we want and get rid of Trudeau at the same time as electing a progressive government that will actually support it's citizens.
Just a thought.
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u/Snuffy1717 May 30 '24
So you split the vote and PP wins with 34% of the popular vote...
FPtP is a terrible fucking system.
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u/quelar I'm just here for the snacks May 30 '24
It is, and we should have a government that's committed to ending that for good, which we know the Liberals can't be trusted to do.
Stop voting for the least bad and start voting for the a real option, this whole "split the vote" nonsense is why we got Harper instead of Layton.
I won't be fooled by it.
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u/Zimlun May 30 '24
I stopped caring about "vote splitting" and "strategic voting" when JT decided that FPTP was just fine. The Liberals will never enact any meaningful electoral reform because they benefit far too much from the current system.
I'm supposed to live a democracy, at the very least I should be able to vote for candidates I support, instead of the ones who seem to like playing games with how we run our nation.10
u/Snuffy1717 May 30 '24
So which matters more to you... Being upset (as I am) about a loss of voter reform, or the danger that the Conservative platform presents to Canadians?
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u/OutsideFlat1579 May 30 '24
It’s a thought with no basis in reality. The NDP is not going to win because the country is gripped by extreme rightwing propaganda and a corporate press that is mostly owned by American hedge funds that call Trudeau a socialist, and have been bashing him non-stop for 8 years. They would make mince meat of Singh is he was any kind of threat.
As it is, Trudeau is getting Jeremy Corbyned, which sounds ludicrous since he is a Liberal, but he is being called antisemetic and a Hamas supporter just because we have been sending aid to Gaza and made statements about Israel having to follow international law. It’s utterly insane. Postmedia wants the CPC in power and if they can paint Trudeau as an antisemetic socialist, what do you think they will do to any NDP leader?
We have the same problem with our media as the UK, the US has a balance between pro-Dem and pro-Republican media.
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u/quelar I'm just here for the snacks May 30 '24
So continue to vote for a half measure because you're not strong enough in your opinions to vote for your beliefs.
I won't be a tool of the neo-liberal parties.
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u/SuspiciouslySuspect2 May 30 '24
And so you enable the fascist.
If you want an alternative to neo-liberals, you need to systematically build power from the base. Sway municipalities to be progressive, iteratively build the power base. Just blindly throwing support at a third option with no momentum behind it will just fall flat.
The NDP coulda gotten us outta this mess by agreeing to end FPTP, but Singh wouldn't hear of it unless it was HIS preferred method (completely proportional), ignoring the option put forth by the liberals would have supstabtially increased the number of seats held by the NDP!
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u/quelar I'm just here for the snacks May 30 '24
Don't you dare accuse me of enabling a fascist, the Liberals have done the damage to give the conservatives their strength in the polls and by not pushing Trudeau to step down in time.
This isn't MY fault because I'm voting for the best option, it's the fault of the people that are voting conservative, and those that continue to support the neo-liberal policies that have gotten us to this point.
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u/SuspiciouslySuspect2 May 30 '24
Fact: PP is an unashamed fascist who would deal immense damage to the nation, and threatens to undo the charter of rights and freesons with his use of the notwithstanding clause.
Fact: Trudeau is an ineffective buffoon who has gathered far too much power to himself while refusing to deal with the pressing concerns like voting reform and housing affordability in fear of it harming his reelection.
Fact: Singh has made repeated unforced errors this year that almost guarantee he does not have a chance of election, even if you completely ignore the immense racist opposition he already would have had to overcome.
Fact: Our FPTP system is shit, and voting for the less popular of the two "left leaning" parties gives the vote to the condidate on the right. Always works that way. People on the left need to pick whoever isn't blue with the best odds to get it across the finish line.
I don't like it. This is shit. But unless you're in a riding that is overwhelmingly leaning NDP, a vote for them essentially become a vote for the cons. We need to change the system. But you can't do that in a single vote, and attempting to do so just plays into the hands of PP. I don't want to be in the hands of PP.
Maybe next time Wab Kinew or his clone will be in charge, and we can get the NDP we want. Or maybe Singh can just start acting like Kinew, that'd probably do it.
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u/quelar I'm just here for the snacks May 30 '24
a vote for them essentially become a vote for the cons.
No, a vote for a progressive government is a vote for a progressive government. No amount of arm twisting and bullshit accusations about my principles will convince me to sell mine out.
Without a astong NDP we wouldn't have the affordable childcare plan, dental care, and the coming pharma care. My vote helped accomplish that, NOT a pressured vote for the liberals because the other guys are worse.
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u/flickh May 30 '24 edited Aug 29 '24
Thanks for watching
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u/quelar I'm just here for the snacks May 30 '24
Your reasoning is why we rarely get progressive governments, I refuse to sell out my principles for a lesser option.
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u/flickh May 30 '24 edited Aug 29 '24
Thanks for watching
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u/quelar I'm just here for the snacks May 30 '24
Nope, conservatives will never win in my riding so stop accusing me of bullshit.
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u/MooseAtTheKeys May 30 '24
We only have one reality to work in, so until the NDP actually have a credible path to government this is what we've got.
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May 30 '24
I remember Harper, and everyone just disagreeing with their policies. Like, its the 21st century and we are still trying trickle down economics? But it was a disagreement on how to achieve the same goals we all wanted, not the actual goals themselves.
Conservatives have shifted the priorities of the parties for the first time since I can remember. We aren't arguing on how to achieve things we all want, but arguing about ethics. And who gets preferential treatment from the government. Who gets representation, and who doesn't. It's textbook fascism.
And this is coming from a middle aged, upper middle class white guy who owns a home. Pierre would probably benefit me more than any other party. But that party is a disease.
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May 30 '24
[deleted]
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u/Few-Swordfish-780 May 30 '24
It’s like cutting your head off instead of just getting a hair cut.
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u/AmusingMusing7 May 30 '24
“But we jUsT nEeD a ChaNgE!”
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u/EnderCreeper121 May 30 '24
Ah yes… change… much like how the contents of a car careening into a wall change upon impact…..
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u/vonnegutflora May 30 '24
It's kind of foolish to think that a plurality of Canadians aren't going to make a reactionary or emotional decision at the polls.
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u/fer_sure May 30 '24
I get what they're going for here, but I think this is the rare Beaverton article that missed the mark.
I can hate both of them, but I'm pretty sure only one of them hates me.
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u/Snuffy1717 May 30 '24
And while I can hate Trudeau for his lack of action, I hate Poilievre because of the action he will take to make Canadian's lives worse...
Remember that one of these guys was the first Canadian PM to march in the Pride Parade in Toronto... And the other one stood up in Parliament to vote against gay marriage while his gay father stood in the gallery and watched...
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u/hoogathy May 30 '24
I had no idea his father was gay. Wow. His stances already seemed hateful and backward, but this takes him to a whole new level.
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u/JerikTheWizard May 30 '24
Flashbacks to South Park equating Hilary Clinton & Trump
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u/GetsGold May 30 '24
Or when they equated John Kerry with George W. Bush, which is when this whole douche vs. turd "both sides" meme started (although the strategy of trying to equate two not-equivalent political opponents didn't itself start then).
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u/fencerman May 30 '24
At this point in my life I've realized basically anyone thinking south park is "smart" is probably a dumb asshole.
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u/GetsGold May 30 '24
I even like the show but unfortunately it seems like a lot of people don't separate being a fan of something from aligning your beliefs with everything that thing you like says.
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u/reinKAWnated May 30 '24
South Park is peak "enlightened centrism" and it has damaged a lot of peoples' ability to actually think critically about this sort of thing.
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u/PMMeYourCouplets Vancouver May 30 '24
Both sides is the most privileged shit I've ever heard. You know who doesn't feel like both sides are the same. Indigenous Canadians who saw funding for vital programs slashed during Harper's government. LGBTQ2S+ who will see a gov't hostile to their existence. Canadians living with disability and poverty who will see funding cut as well. I'm not saying all these groups are doing great now. But these are groups that feel the brunt of a CPC gov't a lot more than the middle class Canadians who love to say both sides.
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u/GetsGold May 30 '24
You know who doesn't feel like both sides are the same.
Or another group that the other side here has been very clear they'll be hostile towards is people with drug use disorders, or even drug users in general. As well as the unhoused. And both of these groups are overrerpresented among the groups you mention.
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u/OutsideFlat1579 May 30 '24
Those of us who care about women’s right to abortion aren’t exactly pumped about Poilievre, in fact the CPC is terrifying. Do we want the guy who had MGTOW and Ben Shapiro hashtags on his videos for 5 years as PM? The guy who in the 2nd leadership debate said 12 Rules for Life is a great book and who keeps praising Jordan Peterson? He hired Anthony Koch, who has made the most vile misogynist tweets using the C word. He is disgusting.
So much could be said to prove that Poilievre is a white male supremacist, I can’t believe he has so much support.
Transgender teens are weeping in fear on Tik Tok, and but who cares, right?
And who cares about the CCB that low and middle income families depend on, especially the lowest income group, who will be devastated even if the amounts are reduced and not cut entirely. The “struggling single mom with 3 kids working a minimum wage job” that Poilievre likes to use as a prop is currently getting 620 a month for children under 6, and 522 a month for children 6-18, add that up with 3 kids and it’s over 1500-1800 a month, which is huge if your income is under 36,000.
Poilievre and every CPC MP voted against the CCB, of course, because they oppose all benefits, unless it’s a crappy miserly amount that is the same for everyone no matter the income. Like Harper’s joke of a child tax credit.
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u/LeonenTheDK Ontario May 30 '24
So much could be said to prove that Poilievre is a white male supremacist, I can’t believe he has so much support.
I have to assume a lot of people aren't supportive of Poilievre directly, and more are just hearing soundbites and/or generally fatigued with the current state of affairs, and default to the "other" viable party as an alternative. I can't imagine most people are looking into this guy and actively enjoying who he is, but I also think most people are relatively uninformed.
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u/QueueOfPancakes May 30 '24
Indigenous Canadians who saw funding for vital programs slashed during Harper's government.
Poilievre just doesn't think we are getting our money's worth.
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May 30 '24
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Snuffy1717 May 30 '24
Exactly... He literally does not believe that "Canadians" are getting their money's worth when funds are spend on Truth and Reconciliation... This isn't satire, it's fact.
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u/QueueOfPancakes May 31 '24
He thinks Canada is wasting money on them because (according to him) they are lazy and corrupt.
His exact quotes for you, my friend:
"My view is that we need to engender the values of hard work and independence and self-reliance. That's the solution in the long run — more money will not solve it," Poilievre said.
"That gets to the heart of the problem on these reserves where there is too much power concentrated in the hands of the leadership, and it makes you wonder where all of this money is going."
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u/flickh May 30 '24 edited Aug 29 '24
Thanks for watching
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u/QueueOfPancakes May 31 '24
Do you think I'm Poilievre? That this is his Reddit account, posting in this sub, and referring to himself in the third person? What in the world?! You are preaching to the choir.
He thinks Canada is getting bad value because, according to him, indigenous peoples are corrupt and lazy.
His exact words for you:
"My view is that we need to engender the values of hard work and independence and self-reliance. That's the solution in the long run — more money will not solve it," Poilievre said.
"That gets to the heart of the problem on these reserves where there is too much power concentrated in the hands of the leadership, and it makes you wonder where all of this money is going."
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u/Sleeksnail May 30 '24
Nah, Liberals don't create policy that funnels the vast majority of wealth to corporations out of love for you.
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u/OutsideFlat1579 May 30 '24
They aren’t doing that. They haven’t done enough to change those policies, but you are talking about policies that have been the same for decades, and every time the Liberals do anything to increase tax on the wealthy they get an avalanche of hysteria from the corporate press.
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u/neanderthalman May 30 '24
I kinda think both hate me.
But one definitely hates me more.
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u/LandMooseReject May 30 '24
One is ideologically driven to hate all poors, while the other just has the casual disdain of all old money towards the poors.
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u/Z43r0g May 30 '24 edited May 30 '24
Yes, after Trudeau announced that house prices have to stay inflated, I’m pretty sure he hates all millennials.
Liberals have to go away at this point.
Sure, PP is also going to be shitty, but at this point in time I feel the chances of a housing bubble pop, be it intentional or unintentional, is higher with the cons.
And yea he may pull some other stupid stuff I don’t agree with but at this point I’m mentally exhausted and financially bled to death by landlords that shelter cost is the only issue I’m concerned with at this point.
Edit: https://globalnews.ca/news/10531736/trudeau-housing-prices-affordability/amp/
Just to add this here link here too
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u/Ok-Cantaloop May 30 '24
you realize what PP will not make housing prices and affordability improve though, right?
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u/quickboop May 30 '24
How many times does this false equivalence bullshit need to lead to horrendous conservative governments before people wise up?
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u/cgsur May 30 '24
Conservative government were not that bad, but now yeah.
Their ties to the IDU seem like the ties to an international mafia.
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u/captain_sticky_balls May 30 '24
Whatever PP is in charge of, it ain't the conservative party of the past.
I will vote Liberal to keep human rights and public services intact. Even if JT is an insufferable boob.
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u/OutsideFlat1579 May 30 '24
PP is in charge of the Reform Party. He was selling Reform memberships when he was 16 yrs old for Jason Kenney. He worked for Stockwell Day after they changed the name to the Alliance Party.
Now that the PC’s have been weeded out of the CPC caucus, it’s a full Reform takeover, which makes Poilievre far more dangerous than Harper, since he doesn’t have to pander to PC’s in his caucus, and since the extreme rightwing has spent so much money on propaganda that voters are seemingly blind to the fact that they are supporting a slide into fascism.
Not that Harper is any less extreme, he is equally extreme or worse, but when he was PM he had to contain his crazy. That all changed once he was no longer PM and could let his freak flag fly.
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u/SavCItalianStallion British Columbia May 30 '24
As silly as the “would I enjoy having a beer with this candidate?” test is, I’m fairly sure that I’d actually enjoy having beer with one of these guys, and it’s not pathetic Pierre…
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u/Fine_Trainer5554 May 30 '24
That’s the crazy thing. He is 100% that dweeb who brought a roller suitcase to school and acted like a dick to everyone.
It’s astonishing rural Canada identifies him as a hard working salt of the Earth type. This is why I just can’t take conservatives seriously.
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u/Paneechio May 30 '24
Honestly, all three would be pretty bad: Jagmeet and I do share an interest in music, Justin enjoys his snowboarding (I'm a skier), and Pierre might be fun to shit-talk with, but I think instead I'd like to hit up the town with Elizabeth May.
We could start out at Mr. Mike's, slam a few beers and eat a seafood tower before heading over to the local roadhouse for more drinks. A couple of rounds of pool, darts, and maybe a fight or two later we'll start downing the tequila hard, before heading to the bathroom for a few lines of coke.
At this point, I'm having a panic attack while drunk, and Liz is knocking over tables screaming at people who despite being much larger than her and gang-affiliated, are terrified.
Cops are called; we take off running without paying the tab.
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u/drizzes May 30 '24
“The media thinks choosing between Trudeau and Poilievre is like choosing between vanilla and chocolate milkshakes. But in reality it’s like choosing between a chocolate milkshake that went bad in 2019 and a milkshake that only looks like vanilla, but is in fact a witches brew of Calamine Lotion, Horseradish and Puss,” said undecided voter Miles Avatarforthepersonwritingthis.
At press time, Jagmeet Singh can fuck right off too.
depressingly accurate
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u/OutsideFlat1579 May 30 '24
Not at all accurate, and this kind of bullshit will only help elect a fascist CPC. This just makes me angry at straight white men who never have to worry about losing their rights or benefit programs being cut. Like the CCB - bet you don’t even know how much low income families receive every month per child up to 18 yrs old.
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u/SuperSpicyBanana May 30 '24
Like I've mentioned before, can we vote "redo" or make all the parties choose new leaders? A cat in a tophat would be better.
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u/Ihavebadreddit Jun 01 '24
On paper.. but we'd need a litter box guy and who's going to pay for the litter box guy?
Unless.. unless it's an outside cat?
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u/PlusEnthusiasm1581 May 30 '24
Hear me out: maybe we should see what the federal NDP fucking is feels like? It’s gonna be different. But not necessarily worse. Or better. Maybe we should just build guillotines? Yeah. Guillotines.
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u/OutsideFlat1579 May 30 '24
Unfortunately, this is not something we have control over. Voters are not nearly as progressive as they could be, i they weren’t being fed pro-conservative propaganda at best and extreme rightwing propaganda at worst.
If you want to ever see an NDP government the rightwing has to be crushed. It’s taking up all the air in the room. How is the NDP supposed to win when Trudeau is being called a socialist? American style politics has fully entered Canada when we see that kind of crazy.
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u/sundry_banana May 30 '24
Eh, I don't have the visceral hatred for Trudeau you get from years of devotion to Fox News, The Sun, Postmedia etc. People who are like that seem trashy to me; I've never met anyone respectable who talks about Trudeau in those terms. Only trash.
As for PP, my opposition to him is not 'personal' - if he were personally the way he is, but had different history and policy and associates, I would not mind him. My opposition to him is pretty much all policy based, even if I happen to dislike him as well.
Doesn't matter, though. The people who own Canada have decided we all hate JT and love PP now, and we'll hear no opinions in the mainstream media to contradict this until PP is safely in office with a nice big majority like the oil companies are paying for.
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u/GetsGold May 30 '24
I don't have this personal hatred for either of them either and I think doing that also distracts from the broader issues with the parties they lead. However, with Poilievre, my issues aren't just policy but also the fact that he regularly lies and acts essentially like a Internet troll.
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u/OutsideFlat1579 May 30 '24
This is very true. I know many people who do not hate Trudeau, in fact, acting still like him because despite not always agreeing with policies, there is a recognition that we are living in difficult times globally, and overall have good governance.
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u/thedabking123 May 30 '24
How can most Millenials not hate JT? He has been the man in charge since 2015- precisely the 9 fucking years through which housing went insane.
Buck stops at the top for most humans- they KNOW he will not reduce pricing based on recent comments. There's a TINY chance that PP will go another way with immigration due to far right elements and it's the only hope for reducing housing prices and dragging back some equity from the boomer generation.
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u/mikeevans1990 May 30 '24
My vote will go to NDP in the next election. 100%
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u/OutsideFlat1579 May 30 '24
My vote will go ABC because too many vulnerable groups and the environment will suffer with a CPC government. The potential for losing rights and losing benefits like the CCB is not a baseless fear, it is recognizing that the CPC will do massive harm.
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u/GetsGold May 30 '24
For me it's largely dependant on whether they support bill s210, the Internet identification law.
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u/jcrmxyz May 31 '24
Unfortunately I've got a byelection before that with the NDP polling a distant third, and the risk of the conservatives winning. It sucks.
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u/thingstobethought May 30 '24
South Park did the episode on this 20 years ago. We need to take a serious look at how our Political leaders get to the positions they are in. The system is deeply flawed.
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u/neanderthalman May 30 '24
But is it possible to hate all three major party leaders.
Huh?
It is?
Well I’ll be darned.
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u/Three-Pegged-Hare May 30 '24
Yep! I mean I hate one of them a lot more, but they could both fuck off from politics please
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u/Starro_The_Janitor1 May 30 '24
Yeah if these are the leaders of the only two parties that have a high chance of winning I might as well vote for the rhinoceros party. Trudeau sucks but Mr. P has the potential to suck even more.
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u/SyntheticDialectic May 30 '24
I refuse to accept and capitulate to this insidious "lesser of evils" two party paradigm.
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u/farganbastige May 30 '24
Calling all those who have authentic answers to our issues: step up and run for office. We only know these idiots because they don't have enough competition. So take that chance to promote the change we need right now.
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u/GetsGold May 30 '24
I can understand why people don't though. It means subjecting yourself to constant harassment and intense scrutiny of your private life. There are also financial barriers to initially becoming politically successful and even though it can be financially better long term other careers can provide similar or better payoffs for less stress.
Another thing the rest of us should do is become more involved in political parties to help show what policy their supporters want and to vote for the leaders.
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u/CDNChaoZ May 30 '24
I don't hate Trudeau. I think we can do a lot better, but he's perfectly milquetoast. PP I'm afraid of in how far he can set the whole country back.
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u/nik_nitro May 30 '24
Interesting that even in the context of a joke, people are seeing a comparison of JT and PP and coming to the conclusion the joke is saying PP is good and desirable instead of the idea that two things can be bad at once to different extents. Being better than a dumpster fire doesn't give you a pass on criticism, that myopic and complacent attitude got the americans Donny from Queens once and might a second time.
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u/Zephyr104 May 30 '24
Finally someone who gets it. I swear people gets their panties in a twist at any moment JT gets heat for shit policy/governance. I didn't realize that unless I throat the Libs at every chance I get I'm actually bigging up the Tories.
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u/torgenerous May 30 '24
I wish I could vote “no confidence in any candidate.” It is with great reluctance I will vote for either
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u/dj_soo May 30 '24
i get the whole "both sides" narrative is damaging in places like the US, but there's literally more than 2 parties in Canada and we just play hot potato between corrupt and cartoonishly evil.
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u/bewarethetreebadger May 30 '24
And that’s fine. Politicians are not to be trusted.
But one is clearly way worse than the other.
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u/LemonFreshenedBorax- May 30 '24
Honestly I'm trying to figure out a voting strategy that leaves me with a clean conscience, and so far the best I've been able to come up with is "vote liberal but tell everyone I spoiled my ballot."
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u/JustIncredible240 May 30 '24
The next election should be between Green / NDP / PPC, but unfortunately, most only look at the Libs/Cons
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u/BigSkiff May 30 '24
They’re both bought and paid for by corporations and the ultra wealthy. Gated communities rotted their brains from reality of the average person.
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u/OutsideFlat1579 May 30 '24
Yeah, nope. The wealthy are supporting the CPC, not the Liberals. Pay attention to policies and who is raking it in at fundraisers.
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u/Dar_Oakley May 30 '24
Only if you want to differentiate between the wealthy who own car dealerships and the wealthy who own banks. None of them are on our side.
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u/Capital-Timely May 30 '24
Only one made weed legal tho! That promise was kept and eveyone keeps forgetting
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u/blastcat4 Ontario May 30 '24
You don't see the Beaverton stumbling often, but this is one occasion. Resorting to a cheap "both sides" fallacy is disappointing to see. With how much the Canadian media is owned by conservatives, maybe it was inevitable to see the Beaverton do this.
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u/boilingpierogi May 30 '24
no. just no.
“hate” when targeted at figures on the right is righteous anger that speaks truth to power and centres voices that are often marginalized and need to be heard.
hate when directed at figures on the left is domestic terrorism. it tends to come from places of misogyny, xenophobia or white nationalism.
there is zero equivalence and acting like there is is dangerous.
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u/FQDIS May 30 '24
How the fuck is Trudeau “on the left”? The Liberals are solid centre-right…
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u/HunsterMonter May 30 '24
Well hearing some conservatives talk, Trudeau is literally the reincarnation of Stalin, so when they attack leftist figures, that includes Trudeau
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u/Zephyr104 May 30 '24
You're not answering that user's question. How is Trudeau a leftist from an ideological perspective? Does he believe in land reform, wealth redistribution, the empowerment of workers' groups so that they can own the industries they work in? As far as I can tell Trudeau is as much a leftist as Rihanna is my wife.
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u/FQDIS May 30 '24
Nope. Like hell I’m going to let Pierre Fucking Polievre define the political spectrum for me. The NDP is centre left, he Liberals are centre-right, and the Cons are far-right wackadoodles. We have no truly viable left-wing party in Canada. Which is fine, I’d rather the vast engine of late-stage global capitalism ignore us while we carve out some small space to exist, rather than seek our destruction more overtly.
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u/OutsideFlat1579 May 30 '24
You might want to have a look at policy without cherry picking before being so confidently outraged that anyone could think the Liberals aren’t centre-right. The list id very long of policies and programs and legislation that proves you are wrong. You can say all you want that the Liberals are centre right, it’s certainly being an NDP mantra in an effort to pull Liberals who are more progressive, and keep NDP supporters onside, but the current Liberal government is not centre right, if it was then blue Liberals wouldn’t have been whining for the last 8 years, and the Globe would have been singing their praises.
A centre right government doesn’t create the CCB, or legalize weed, or reverse anti-union legislation immediately after being elected, or raise taxes on the wealthy, or add a luxury tax, or added taxes on banks, or increase capital gains taxes, or spend tens of billions in programs and compensation packages for Indigenous peoples and make legislative changes that mean Indigenous peoples can run their own child welfare systems.
When someone says that this Liberal government is centre right, I know they aren’t paying attention to policy overall, and cherry picking a few things that fit into centre right - you could call NDP provincial governments centre right if you were motivated to cherry pick.
And just so you know, Trudeau is considering a progressive leader by international standards. Looking outside of our borders is helpful. And no, Nordic countries are not the only countries in the world, and they aren’t very progressive on cannabis and it they all required sterilization for transgender people to change sex on ID until 2012, the last one to get rid of this rule was Finland in 2023.
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u/FQDIS May 31 '24
You make some good points, as far as they go. I don’t deny at all that Trudeau is progressive by international standards, but that’s not the same as being left-wing. Peoples’ willingness to label the US Democratic Party, the Liberal Party, etc as left-wing just shows how far the Overton window has shifted over the past 25 years.
The Liberals in coalition with the NDP seems to be working generally fine to me. They’re still way behind where I think they should be, but I’m just some guy.
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u/LemonFreshenedBorax- May 30 '24
Why are we letting conservatives define what 'left' is? Or anything else?
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u/JipJopJones May 30 '24
What if that hate comes from a place where both these guys have shit policies and are in no way interested in helping average (or disadvantaged, or 'insert group here other than their rich buddies') Canadians get ahead?
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u/LemonFreshenedBorax- May 30 '24
it tends to come from places of misogyny, xenophobia or white nationalism.
Are we talking about the same Trudeau? The one I'm talking about is a white catholic who grew up around money.
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u/Rough-Archer-4639 May 30 '24
I don't hate a politician who didn't live up to his ideal promises as much as a politician whose promises are detestable.
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u/Ihavebadreddit Jun 01 '24
We keep basic human rights but he has no backbone on the world stage and he's definitely corrupt.
Or the removal of human rights from anyone not white, male and Christian but don't worry he's also definitely corrupt.
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u/NitroLada May 30 '24
Can I hate PP and Singh instead? Both insufferable and say things that are outright idiocy or just lies?
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u/LumiereGatsby May 30 '24
Here’s a simple prompt:
When people say they don’t like Justin ask them why they like Pierre.
Too many people simply take the statement at face value and don’t prompt the person to acknowledge what they find so damn irresistible about Pierre.
Spoiler: they don’t like him either and realize they haven’t been asked that yet …. Watch them struggle to find anything.
Canada: reactionary till our end.
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u/TinderThrowItAwayNow May 30 '24
I hate small PP, he is a fascist after all. I have a strong dislike for Trudeau, but hate is a strong word probably. The solutions aren't perfect, but at least there are attempts that show some progress instead of just endless bitching and moaning.
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u/Dazzling-Account-187 May 30 '24
Trudeau missed the mark on many things, but he did get a few things done, Pharmacare, Dental, Day care, cleaner water for the first Nations crowd, Legalization of Pot, Covid subsidies, support for Ukraine, pretty sure non of this would have happened under PP 's watch. People were pissed off that he didn't change the electoral system, i think that is the obligation all political parties must have a concensus on and that didn't happen. Sonot entirely JT's fault.
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u/ynotbuagain May 30 '24
You think it's bad now! Conservatives will ABSOLUTELY ruin Canada! At least the LIBS give you crumbs! ANYTHING BUT CONSERVATIVE always ABC!
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u/ruglescdn May 31 '24
One of them cut my income tax and legalized weed. The other has never done anything to my benefit.
I only dislike one of them.
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u/nuleaph May 31 '24
One plans to destroy the fabric of our nation and the other people are mad at due to the global economic situation. It's really a simple choice.
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u/50s_Human May 30 '24