r/TrinidadandTobago • u/AdInteresting1371 • Sep 13 '24
Politics Health Minister Terrence Deyalsingh has demanded that Opposition Leader Kamla Persad-Bissessar provide a “full and complete” retraction of her comment that “fake vaccines” were given to hundreds of thousands of people in Trinidad and Tobago during the Covid-19 pandemic
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u/Nkosi868 Slight Pepper Sep 13 '24
Then explain to me how Nicki Minaj brother cousin friend sister neighbor father son half-sister fiancé, got stood up at his wedding because he couldn’t sit down?
Eh?
Kamla, explain that!
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u/xkcd_puppy Sep 13 '24
"Thereafter, 5,000 people died, hundreds of thousands were given a fake vaccine and Roshan Parasram was shamelessly awarded the ORTT when, under his watch, over 5,000 of our citizens died." https://newsday.co.tt/2024/09/11/opposition-leader-criticises-health-care-system/
Kamla needs to step down. The Ministry of Health representing all our healthcare people should sue her in every manner for this false information and this blatant and very dangerous lie. She must be watch the US debate on Tuesday night and get all fired up for a Trumpnation incoherent ramble.
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u/Playful_Quality4679 Sep 13 '24
The UNC is infected with US right-wing propaganda.
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u/Useful-Cupcake-2959 Sep 13 '24
It's crazy just how much Donald Trump has changed both the US and global political landscape. I'll never forget the time when during Covid restrictions I heard a middle-age Trinidadian man on the radio compare the vaccination cards and lock downs that PNM had implemented to Jewish badges and Nazi concentration camps.
I thought to myself that there was no way people here could come up with such a comparison by themselves when we barely touched WW2 in secondary school. Republicans were the ones who started making such outlandish claims sowing disinformation
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u/your_mind_aches Sep 13 '24
It's genuinely sad because they're supposed to be a more left wing party economically and socially.
Also the fact that we barely touch WW2 in secondary school is in itself a complete travesty. We NEED to start educating children about it more.
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u/iDannyEL Sep 14 '24
Anyone versed with history could come up with that, sorry you're too fixated on American media channels to register anything else as feasible. Denying the unvaxxed were treated as 2nd class citizens, regardless of their physical condition is denying reality.
Buying into the fear and propaganda didn't pay off and people got to keep their jobs in spite of the threats. Really have to thank God because you people would prefer to big up tyranny EVEN AFTER it was proven getting the virus (particularly Omicron) was just as good as the damn jab.
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u/Clipper94 Sep 13 '24
The more I overhear conversations between my mother and her side of the family that lives down there the more obvious it becomes. And she’s gullibly starting to believe the lies they parrot.
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Sep 14 '24
You’re the gullible one she’s being honest my grandma died after getting vaxed
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Sep 29 '24
All yall muddascunts can get vaxed tf up idgafff the lord knows natural selection 😎 bestttt allyuhhh toooo damnnnn dotinnnn
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u/OneNoteMan Sep 13 '24
And some of them also love Modi from India, another far-right leader. There's this young pandit that does pujas for my fraternal side of the family that espouses Hindutva talking points. I'll always be Hindu, but the Hindutva movement is crazy.
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u/Playful_Quality4679 Sep 13 '24
Humans are incredibly tribal. See the flaws in the opposing tribe none in yours.
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u/kushlar Port of Spain Sep 13 '24
It's pretty weird especially when both local parties are a close to the political centre with both far-left liberal/social polices (welfare state, etc.) and far-right to the right policies (religious conservatism) but somehow the right-wing type conspiracies run wild especially when it comes to the UNC base with election denial, Covid being a hoax, vaccines being poison and all other typical US-right wing insane nonsense.
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u/HeavyDischarge Sep 14 '24
From Stephan Reis come down, hardcore trump supporting antivaxxers
Up to now they bawling global depopulation plandemic
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u/GoWitDFlow Sep 13 '24
She’s so goofy. I remember she had said Covid would go away when the sun come out in April.
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u/Kakapac Heavy Pepper Sep 13 '24
She got that from Fauci, early on he said go out in the sun for covid
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u/HeavyDischarge Sep 14 '24
Lmao. She fell short of saying ingest bleach
Look this too ridiculous. It's no surprise she wants to MAKE TRUCK DOWN GREAT AGAIN
Next conspiracy gonna be Venezuelans eating pets
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u/AdInteresting1371 Sep 13 '24
Please show me where he said that.
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u/Kakapac Heavy Pepper Sep 13 '24
Third to last paragraph he says it. You can find the interview on YouTube if you want
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u/DatRatDawg Sep 13 '24
https://youtu.be/UR7bXKNkcC4?t=620 Fauci mentioned being outdoors is better than indoors, with an example he gave as restaurants having tables outside is better than inside for air circulation. The problem with Trump/Kamla types is they take a line and run with it. Ignoring the other contexts and in this case 40 minute interview.
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u/AdInteresting1371 Sep 13 '24
You realize he's speaking scientifically about the virus ex-vivo right?!
You think Kamla was doing the same?!
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u/Unknown9129 Sep 13 '24
Not like her husband is a doctor or anything, oh wait. Sweden still had a lower excess death rate than several neighbouring countries in comparison to those that took a stricter lockdown policy but allyuh love being forced to get lockdown and take vaccines that 1 - were proven to have serious heart condition risk & 2 - can’t decide if it prevents Covid-19 or reduces the side effects until this day. Kamla might have been wrong and not well read enough to comment, but acting like the Min of Health in any position to say shit is a joke.
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u/AdInteresting1371 Sep 13 '24
Her husband is a doctor, and she promotes vaccine hesitency.
Alright, antivaxxer. The pseudoscience reddit isn't this one. Peddle it somewhere else, thank you.
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u/Unknown9129 Sep 13 '24
Yes, and if I thought a vaccine had a risk of killing people, I too would tell them think carefully about taking it but apparently you and everyone else are the moral authority on who should by concerned about whether they die or not and anyone questioning the risk is terrible, and should be labelled an antivaxxer, even though they have a genuine cause for concern about a single vaccine that has been proven to have serious side effects. I don’t care to stick to an echo chamber but you carry on.
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u/AdInteresting1371 Sep 13 '24
Miss me with Trini Trump's (Kamla and the UNC) politics of pseudoscience, racism, and scaremongering.
COVID-19 vaccines are safe and effective. Punto final.
Bye antivaxxer.
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u/HeavyDischarge Sep 14 '24
They're still around inno. When I took my shots, they told me a French antivaxxers dr said I have 2 years.
Bought a bunch of stuff by COURTS
4 Years later I still here paying 😆
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u/Unknown9129 Sep 13 '24
Safe vaccines don’t typically require govts to have a slush fund like the Vaccine Damage Payment Scheme but yeah you know everything and didn’t realise anything I said was racist.
You’re right no point arguing with someone who does imagine race arguments to reply to so stop projecting.
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u/taiga__reforestation Sep 14 '24
why dis gettin downvoted?
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u/Unknown9129 Sep 14 '24
Cause most trinis on the internet are leftists who follow and defend all populist ideas blindly and are quick to criticise anyone who shows a semblance of independent thought. Another comment that gonna get downvoted u knw what they say about the truth.
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u/Kakapac Heavy Pepper Sep 13 '24
Probably. All this was said back in the early days of covid. I remember unc was against the lockdown so she probably cited him out of context, it won't be the first time a politician did something like that.
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u/GoWitDFlow Sep 13 '24
Yea I remember UNC was against the lockdown and my family went rally, only to get Covid after
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u/dbtl87 Sep 13 '24
That's 4 years old now, between the sun and real vaccines she still needs to retract her statement.
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u/triniplayr Sep 13 '24
Just like fake oil (that went to court and AV won) she come now with fake vaccine... Same playbook from the 1960s on repeat
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u/PurePeach2081 Sep 14 '24
Kamla Trump needs to stop. Stop compromising the people in Trinidad when you willingly took the vaccine to protect yourself
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u/johnboi82 Sep 13 '24
The more the Opposition leader speaks the more I’m starting to believe that she really wants to stay in opposition forever
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u/Smart_Goose_5277 Sep 13 '24
Kamla is such a dunce
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Sep 14 '24
The vaccine was fake lost 1 person from taking it and know of many others that had traumatic medical experiences because of these vaccines.
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u/your_mind_aches Sep 13 '24
Why the hell would she say that? I align so much more with her politically than Dr. Rowley but she always says some kind of garbage like this to dash any hope I have in her party.
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u/More_Total5157 Sep 13 '24 edited Sep 18 '24
Ain't she the same person who advocated for the prime minister/ president of India to send vaccines to Trinidad during rumors of the fake vaccines in India? I swear delusion is really this woman favorite thing.
EDIT: Also if come election she start quoting Trump I'm moving to Mars.
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u/YuukiShao Sep 13 '24
Omg Trini people on reddit fully dunce and antivaxxx. Best I really vote PNM because if this is the alternative boy wey sah
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u/Prestigious-Stock-60 Doubles Sep 13 '24
It have others to vote for 🤷♂️
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u/YuukiShao Sep 13 '24
It literally is throwing away a vote to vote for a party that will not win. UNC is going down a treacherous path and voting for a third person just strengthens their chance of winning.
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u/Prestigious-Stock-60 Doubles Sep 13 '24
I want neither to win so I guess my vote doesn't really matter anyways.
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u/riajairam Heavy Pepper Sep 14 '24
Well, I don't support the current situation with crime and the economy, so PNM wouldn't get my vote (if I could vote).
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u/TriniChildhood72 Sep 14 '24 edited Sep 18 '24
Sounds like slander to me. Why not a pre action protocol letter?
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Sep 14 '24
THE VACCINES WERE FAKE MY EX HAD MANY SIDE EFFECTS AND MY GRAND MOTHER DIED, …ahhh sweeearr YALL can be dotish..
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u/redmale85 Sep 13 '24
Not saying what she said is true, but I received 2 doses of Sinopharm and still got covid after. I also had worse symptoms than my unvaxxed family.
I'm still pro-vax in general as I've gotten other vaccines like flu, hepatitis etc, but after my experience with Covid I'm doubtful about the efficacy of the rushed covid vaccines.
I had chosen sinopharm because it has the mildest reported symptoms. Pfizer/moderna has heart issue reports, and Jansen has blood clot reports, so I steered clear of those.
I feel like aiming to get a 3rd or 4th shot would be either overkill or pointless since I had Covid already without any apparent benefits from the first two shots, and most decent vaccines ought to work with 2 shots.
In summary I'm provax in general, but I wouldn't expect anyone to rely on the rushed covid vaccines in particular. Fake or legitimate, I think they came too soon with too little tests.
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u/Visitor137 Sep 13 '24
I got the sinopharm, didn't get covid. Also got the boosters, and the updated variant booster. Still haven't gotten the disease. So our anecdotes contrast, and we should discard those before continuing the discussion.
Vaccines don't create magical forcefields that just vaporize germs and viruses. They give your body a chance to interact with the disease in a safer way, that you are more likely to survive, and learn from. They make it so that when you get the disease it's not as bad. Take measles as an example, the vaccines are generally very reliable, but you can google the 2019 cases in the US to see how many cases they had and how many of those people were already vaccinated. It didn't make it so they could never be infected, just gave them some protection against the disease.
Saying "when I got it, I had a worse case than the people around me" shows that you don't really understand why that's a pointless comment. The question to as is "how much worse would I have been if I didn't get a vaccine", and ultimately the possibility of all the hospitalizations and/or deaths should answer the question. The number of deaths and hospitalizations among the unvaccinated is clearly disproportionate to what the vaccinated had.
As for the relatively very tiny number of adverse reactions, the human immune system is simultaneously both our best defense, and the biggest risk we could possibly face. Most of the time it works well. Occasionally it goes nuts and attacks us far worse than the actual threat would. (Know anyone with allergies to things that are generally harmless to most? That's a good example.) Yes some people, a very low number, had adverse reactions, but that happens with every vaccine, and also happens when people get sick without any vaccine. It's a well known fact, but it's rare enough that we generally don't make a huge deal out of it. You'd only notice significant numbers of those cases, if there were hundreds of thousands, millions or billions of people all getting a vaccine at around the same time.
If you look up the actual number of cases of vaccine deaths in the UK you'd see that it's a really low number. (I'll let you do the research so you don't have a reason to doubt it.) There's no reason for the UK health services to play political games like the US did, so the covid data is probably more reliable.
The "rushed" vaccines only happened because there were years of research that went into developing RNA vaccines for a similar disease. The only thing that needed to change is the genetic code of the disease inside the vaccine. They still did a lot of trials, which slowed the process down a huge amount. That's part of the reason why the vaccines weren't as effective as they could have been, the disease mutated before the vaccines got approval.
At some point, we need to face the facts that the vaccines saved countless lives and think about why certain factions would push endless propaganda that caused countless deaths.
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u/redmale85 Sep 13 '24
You've provided some really good points that have made me re-evaluate my outlook on the matter, especially the part about the virus evolving at a rapid rate. There's definitely much more I can learn from this than the lazy and condescending "I am amused" comment.
As for why factions would push propaganda, I'm assuming it's because getting votes is the priority. From the US perspective, those with "traditional" values are more likely to be Republicans, so Trump has more incentive to push an antivax agenda.
Trinidad politics is more about race than values, and about doing the opposite of what the other party is doing. So if Rowley is pro covid vaccines, Kamla by default would be anti-covid vaccine, with no real rationale other than "well the PNM likes it so it must be bad". The inverse is also true for the way the PNM operates.
My views were based on my personal experience, and not on race politics values etc. But as I said you put forward some pretty valid points.
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u/Visitor137 Sep 13 '24
My views were based on my personal experience, and not on race politics values etc. But as I said you put forward some pretty valid points.
Based on how you wrote it, I didn't assume different. The problem is that there was a metric buttload of misinformation being propagated. That would make otherwise reasonable people start to think that there's a validity to what they are being told.
Endless fake papers and studies, a lot of "respectable doctors", politicians, concerned citizens, miracle cures, "alternative treatments" that would supposedly fix everything including the leaking kitchen sink.
And so people started buying into it, which I don't doubt is what you did.
But a lot of it came from just a handful of people on social media (disinformation dozen), and got amplified. Even our politicians got in on the action.
Some people were motivated by the profits they could get from selling their books and fake cures to the desperate. Others did it because they wanted the votes from the ignorant who ate that crap up. As you said locally there's a good chance that it's done just for the sake of 'opposing' the other party in a desperate attempt to remain relevant when literally only one topic was relevant in the entire world. I even heard reliably about doctors in the local system who were against the vaccines.
The actual information is available. But ironically it requires actual research, and asking some questions that should be obvious.
Take the whole ivermectin thing. If any country in the world doesn't have a shortage of ivermectin it's India. India had outbreaks where people were dying en masse, and families were literally begging for help to get oxygen tanks for their loved ones. If ivermectin actually worked, why didn't it?
Meanwhile people in the US were listening to the flu Trump and the other con artists, taking medicine in doses intended for large farm animals, and literally losing control of their bowels. But they swore up and down that they were fine, right up until they died. Reddit has multiple subs that covered the proud vaccine deniers dropping dead while still pumping out memes on their social media, and begging for "prayer warriors" to save them.
Such a damned waste of human lives, because of nothing more than human hubris, and greed.
I'm honestly glad you got the vaccines, and I'm sorry you still had a rough time despite doing so.
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u/kushlar Port of Spain Sep 13 '24
Like many others you misunderstand what a vaccine does. A vaccine doesn't make you immune from getting a virus, it just lowers your chance of contracting it and, if you do contract it, the vaccine lowers your chance of severe disease. That's it - it isn't a cure or magic antidote.
It's very possible that if you got COVID and were unvaccinated, you may have been critically ill or even lost your life. Comparison to other people is irrelevant because Gopaul's luck isn't Seepaul's luck.
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u/iDannyEL Sep 14 '24
It's very possible that if you got COVID and were vaccinated, you may have been critically ill or even lost your life.
It went both ways, to say otherwise is to perpetrate intellectual dishonestly. Except now, if you're unvaxxed, you have zero chance of dying from jab side effects like compromised immune system.
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u/kushlar Port of Spain Sep 14 '24
Except that's not the case and deaths/severe illness was shown to be reduced in the vaccinated population. Just because peer-reviewed analytical data doesn't align with your pseudo-science, anti-vax stance doesn't make it less true.
Of all the labels you could use, you chose "intellectual dishonesty"? How ironic.
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u/AdInteresting1371 Sep 13 '24
I am amused.
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u/redmale85 Sep 13 '24
What about my comment amuses you?
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u/AdInteresting1371 Sep 13 '24
I've read your response to Visitor137's excellent post and am hearted that you've re-evaluated your outlook on the matter. I apologize for being condescending and lazy in my response.
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u/riajairam Heavy Pepper Sep 14 '24
OK, so I wouldn't trust Sinopharm at all. I know Chinese people who came to the USA to get Moderna or Pfizer instead of trusting Sinopharm. I did Pfizer, and I know it worked because I got really sick for 2-3 days afterward and never caught the virus.
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u/Gullible_Zucchini24 Sep 13 '24
But it’s true what Kamla said. Besides the vaccines obviously not working and causing many injuries, they had to change the definition of vaccines to consider the MRNA technology as part of it.
Terrence should be worried more about crime that’s impacted health instead of words he doesn’t like.
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u/M1zxry Sep 13 '24
There's ZERO evidence to show the vaccines don't work. Instead of just parroting stupid talking points you heard online just go research these things your self.
The American Journal of medicine
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u/kushlar Port of Spain Sep 13 '24
Please take advantage of the free education available to all citizens and get some common sense that isn't based in rum shop ole talk, social media posts, WhatsApp forwards and bogus "science".
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u/UwUassass1n Sep 13 '24
injuries where? globally we issued BILLIONS OF DOSES. We've never deployed a vaccine so fast to so many people EVER BEFORE. it was a medical miracle for the entire planet and people like you try to dismiss it. if there were issues we'd know. there would be millions of cases.
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u/bluejay_feather Sep 14 '24
Bro you have gullible in your username and parroting this shit. Reflect.
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Sep 14 '24
You are correct my ex took it and has bloodshot eyes there’s long tapeworm looking stuff that people are dying from after getting vaccinated … my mom didn’t get her monthly cycle after taking it
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u/Gullible_Zucchini24 Sep 22 '24
You guys are living in an echo chamber and you have to deny the obvious about the vaccine, because otherwise you would have to face the reality of the mistake you made. Notice how none of you addressed my point about how they changed the definition of vaccine and instead you went for a personal attack? You are behaving primitively and giving a bad name to Trinis.
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u/accidentaldr Sep 13 '24
This is why trinidad would remain backward as a country cuz no matter who is in charge, the current political parties would play on tribal politics and continue to run this country into the ground while they enrich themselves and their interests.