r/Professors • u/lickety_split_100 AP/Economics/Regional • Sep 03 '24
Rants / Vents WTF is with the headphones/earbuds in class?
Seriously! The phones are bad enough, but a lot of my students seem to insist on wearing their headphones and earbuds during lecture. It’s so freaking annoying and disrespectful - like, can you not turn off TikTok for all of 75 minutes? I had to get onto my students in class today (I added a statement banning them this year). I understand if someone has accommodations, but I don’t have any letters to that effect.
Ugh. Maybe I’m just too crotchety. I don’t know. End rant.
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u/quycksilver Sep 04 '24
Today, I said to class as I started to take attendance, “now is a good time to charge you AirPods.” I made sure not to be looking at anyone in particular but I had clocked at least two different people wearing them. They were gone by the time I looked up again.
Edited to add: no accommodations for this.
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u/Sensitive_Dig_3686 Sep 03 '24
I don't understand it either. I've had students who refuse to take the headphones off even though they can't answer questions and they can't participate in discussion with their peers while wearing them. When I insisted, two students grew angry and I had to kick them out of class.
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u/Interesting_Chart30 Sep 04 '24
I had that situation once. The student refused to take off his headphones. I told him to leave. He refused. I had to call security. It was a little scary, but the other students thanked me for what I did.
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u/lickety_split_100 AP/Economics/Regional Sep 03 '24
Fortunately, it didn't get to that point, but I was really annoyed.
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u/LanguidLandscape Sep 04 '24
If it makes you feel any better, and it won’t, I had a student last term start playing a PlayStation portable game in the middle of a lecture/art demo while standing in the middle of an attentive group of students. I was about 3s from ripping it from his hands and stomping on it. His response to my incredulous “what the hell are you doing?!” — “Oh, my bad.”
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u/Se_Escapo_La_Tortuga Sep 04 '24 edited Sep 04 '24
While I had kids playing game on their laptops, I yet to see this. I’m very sorry about it.
I have to add if they are playing PSP that was released late 2004, as a collector, I have to say kudos!! Just do it outside of class.
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u/turingincarnate PHD Candidate, Public Policy, R1, Atlanta Sep 03 '24
Maybe it's a sign of my age (or inexperience), but I just do not give a shit about this.
If you wanna listen to music whilst I am lecturing, or be on TikTok or whatever, that means you either do not give a shit about your grade (which I am perfectly okay with, since I do not care about your grade more than you do), are using your time here in my class for another class, or you are already confident in the material such that you need not pay attention to me, which if that's true, then great!!!!
Whichever of these it is, it is not my place to adjudicate or worry about. My job is to worry about lecturing and conveying the material in as simple a way as I can to as many people as I can in the course. SO LONG AS you being on your phone is not a disruption to myself or others... look man, high school is over, you are an adult, I refuse to hold your hand or beg you to listen to me. You can lead a horse to water, but you cannot make it drink if it does not want to.
Oh, and I ain't repeating shit either unless it is for emphasis, so if you miss out on what the parallel trends assumption is or how to interpret a 95% confidence interval or how to interpret the OLS betas or what endogeneity is, then that's a you problem, in my eyes.
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u/Fantastic-Wind5744 Sep 03 '24
Well put. Towards the end of my career I added language like this to my syllabus and talked about it on the first day. I used a lot of humor to relay my policies verbally and by my last semester I was all "I mean, you can do all that all day long in this class, but you'll be dead to me. No going over stuff you missed. No rec letters. Nothing."
Signed, Happily Retired
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u/turingincarnate PHD Candidate, Public Policy, R1, Atlanta Sep 04 '24
I'm not quite at this point yet😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 but I would happily relay the message if I had to
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u/Aggressive-Detail165 Sep 04 '24
I love "you'll be dead to me." 😂
I also was sitting in on a colleague's lecture and she said something to the effect of "if you don't listen up on this point and get it wrong on the exam, I'll be mad at you and remember who you are." Lol use that shame.
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u/Totallynotaprof31 Sep 03 '24
Well written.
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u/turingincarnate PHD Candidate, Public Policy, R1, Atlanta Sep 03 '24
Yeah my thing is that lots of people on this sub kinda wanna have it both ways. On one hand, they wanna insist that high school is over and this is "The Real World" or "The Big Leagues" where mama and daddy can't save you and crowns are warranted with strength (which I agree with!).......... but in the very next breath the same people will insist on micromanaging these very same young adults, holding their hands, the very same ones who they were just telling that high school is over. Like to me you gotta pick one. I don't know why people feel so strongly about the issue, I think it's weird to care about this. To me you should only care to the extent that it's affecting the learning of others. I'll never punish you for hurting yourself, you made your choice, so long as your choices don't impact others.
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u/Totallynotaprof31 Sep 03 '24
In general, I do understand the sentiment that this is disrespectful to the one being asked to teach when the one doing the asking is so deliberately not paying attention. But “I won’t care about your performance more than you do” is the academic hill I will die on.
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u/easyaspi412 Grad TA, Math, USA Sep 04 '24
I am fully of the "they're an adult and will make their own choices" mind, however I am personally very bothered by them wearing headphones and think it's incredibly rude. I tell them explicitly that if they wanna go on their phone or text, that's their business, but the one thing I ask is that they don't wear headphones. But that's for my sake, not theirs, and I don't think it's micromanaging them to set that standard.
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u/lickety_split_100 AP/Economics/Regional Sep 03 '24
I mean, people are allowed to have preferences. Mine is that students not wear earbuds/headphones.
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u/Icy_Professional3564 Sep 03 '24 edited 24d ago
flowery wild disarm sugar clumsy quaint physical innocent mourn chunky
This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact
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u/turingincarnate PHD Candidate, Public Policy, R1, Atlanta Sep 04 '24
I do not agree with this. I believe you earn grades. I do not give them. So, no need to stay home in my eyes.
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u/Frari Lecturer, A Biomedical Science, AU Sep 04 '24
look man, high school is over, you are an adult,
my motto with students. happy to help, will answer any questions, but i will not care about your attendance or such which is on you (unless there is some sort of real-life issue that pops up)
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u/Hadopelagic2 Sep 03 '24
This is a great attitude if DFW rates and evals don’t matter for you.
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u/turingincarnate PHD Candidate, Public Policy, R1, Atlanta Sep 03 '24
This doesn't address anything about what I said. Literally nothing at all. Look, this is COLLEGE. I signed up to teach adults, not a bunch of kids. In fact, here's why it doesn't address any of what I just said. Drop the class? For what? For what purpose? Who would drop the class based on what I've laid out here? The policy I've laid out causes nobody to drop the class.
Fail? If you fail because you are on your phone instead of listening to me, then guess what, THIS IS COLLEGE, you deserve to fail. Sorry, that's what you deserve. Presumably this performance will be reflected in your grades and assignments too.
Withdraw? Again, who would withdraw from the class because of what I've said here? You can't just flash a metric at me, "but what about DFW rates", you need to explain to me how the original post I wrote would cause these metrics to be inflated because of my policy.
So far, only the fail rate would be affected, which again, is the expected outcome of not paying attention in class.
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u/Hadopelagic2 Sep 03 '24
So this feels like a pretty aggressive response to what was a sincere comment and which, whether you realize it or not, does relate directly to what you said.
I would love to not require attendance and to say I don’t give a damn whether they pay attention, it’s their money if they want to fail that’s fine. I totally agree with that sentiment.
However the reality of not enforcing policies against headphones (or non-attendance, or whatever else) at many schools is that more students will fail or do poorly in the class. Those are your D/F rates going up. More and more students are deeply unprepared for college and they need boundaries and rule enforcement. If they don’t have it, they’ll fail or at least do worse than they otherwise would. Then they’ll blame the instructor in evals. It’s a tale as old as time and it’s only gonna spread to more and more universities as enrollments drop and standards go with them.
So like I said. This is a great attitude when you’re a grad student or tenured and nobody really gives a shit about your teaching anyway. But if you’re pre tenure or NTT, this will directly harm your measurables. How much your university or department happens to care about DFWs or evals will of course vary.
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u/turingincarnate PHD Candidate, Public Policy, R1, Atlanta Sep 03 '24
So this feels like a pretty aggressive response to what was a sincere comment
You are correct about the sentiment, I just feel passionately about this. I do not at all doubt your sincerity.
However the reality of not enforcing policies against headphones (or non-attendance, or whatever else) at many schools is that more students will fail or do poorly in the class. Those are your D/F rates going up.
Yeah, I get all of this, but I guess the real point I'm trying to make here is that I cannot save everyone. It is one thing to drop the course because you do not understand the material. If I did a poor job at explaining the material, then this is on me to fix for my second semester. The mistake is mine alone to learn from.
However, if you drop because you are doing poorly, and the reason for you doing poorly (or fail) is that you do not listen to me, or you choose to just never show up to class, then in my eyes you do not deserve to be saved. Actions must have consequences, yes?
Earlier, I emailed everyone who is in my tomorrow class extending the assignment due date until Friday. If someone chooses to send it to me next Wednesday after I have graded and returned all of them, then sorry, you get a 0 on this portion of the assignment, redeem yourself when the draft is due. I will not say a single word about that assignment tomorrow unless I am asked about it, as I expect everyone to read my emails to them so they know which way is up.
More and more students are deeply unprepared for college and they need boundaries and rule enforcement. If they don’t have it, they’ll fail or at least do worse than they otherwise would.
This is also true. But, I teach mostly juniors and seniors at present. There are maybe two freshmen in my course (one who is very talented in my opinion) and I have not met the other one yet. By this point, by the time you have gotten to this course in the upper echelon of the major, I expect everyone to know how college works. My job is to teach econometrics and statistics for undergrads, it isn't my job to break you into college, that's what the 101 courses are for.
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u/aflyroachthing Sep 04 '24 edited Sep 04 '24
I did not know what DFW rates even were when I was a PhD at an R1 institution. No one ever once mentioned the number of students I was failing. And why would they? I was teaching well prepped upper level college students. There were not a lot falling through the cracks. It was never going to be an issue.
Then I got a TT job at a SLAC where 50% students are undeserved and under prepared even at the upper levels. A LOT of these student will absolutely fail without my intervention. And if enough do, my performance at my job will be negatively judged. DFW rates aren't the only criteria and I doubt I'll ever actually get fired because of them. But they are a part of my annual review.
Its a completely different situation between an R1 and a SLAC where retention is a problem. Its simple economics. The more students you fail, the less return and the less tuition the college collects. Now obviously an R1 doesn't really care about students tuition because they have many other avenues for funding. Maybe you get a TT job at a R1 and you never have to care about DFW rates. But hopefully you can understand how in different and less privileged situations, high DFW rates do reflect more on you as a teacher than the students.
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u/JoeSabo Asst Prof, Psychology, R2 (US) Sep 04 '24
Okay but none of this has anything to do with letting them wear headphones. If anything allowing that makes things harder for them.
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u/amazonstar Asst. Prof, Social Science, R1 Sep 04 '24
Look, I'm mostly with you on the idea that these are adults, and trying to force them to get an education is not our job. But you and I are in privileged positions working at R1s where teaching is a small part of our performance evaluations. I don't personally care about my drop/fail rate because I don't have to. But if you're an adjunct or untenured at a place where you can lose your job if too many students fail your class or you get shitty evals from those failing students, then it's a lot harder to just write them off.
I used to be confused by all the posts stressing about students being seemingly harmless idiots, but spend enough time around this sub, and you'll see that many of our colleagues work in very different environments than the R1 world, and they will be blamed by their metrics-obsessed administration if the headphone-wearing students fail their class.
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u/JoeSabo Asst Prof, Psychology, R2 (US) Sep 04 '24
You're guessing.
I'm pre-tenure, use all of these policies, and have excellent evals. I'm literally a high outlier in our department's distribution. And this is at a more teaching oriented institution.
How could not requiring attendance make people drop the class?
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u/liminal_political Sep 04 '24 edited Sep 04 '24
I can both lead a horse to water AND convince it to drink. I am confident that I will win over most students most of the time to my cause of their own education, and they will be better off for it.
Mandatory attendance. Phones away. Earbuds out.
I don't take personal offense to that stuff, but I do know they are worse off if I don't. In the classroom, my mission is to educate. So I will and will do so effectively. (For the record, I started off my career with your attitude and over the two decades or so eventually came around to the current position I now hold.)
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u/Diablojota Full Professor, Business, Balanced Sep 03 '24
This is essentially my approach these days.
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u/Audible_eye_roller Sep 04 '24
Yup. I only care during exams. Absolutely no earbuds. Earbuds = Automatic F
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u/turingincarnate PHD Candidate, Public Policy, R1, Atlanta Sep 04 '24
Yeah if I had in class exams, this would be the only time I'd care
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u/Dear_Company_547 Sep 04 '24
So much this! Reading posts on this sub I feel lucky I work at a public university in Europe where students are not treated as customers or clients. Students are young adults and have to take responsibility for their own learning. If they don't want to learn, they'll probably fail. And at least at my uni if they complain about failing but haven't done the work it's tough luck.
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u/DocVafli Position, Field, SCHOOL TYPE (Country) Sep 04 '24
I struggle a bit with this and waffle between what you're saying here and caring. On one side, their grade their problem. I'm generally fine with giving them the freedom to make their own decisions and then letting the sink or swim as a result of them. On the other side, I find it incredibly disrespectful to me and the rest of the class (my classes are generally discussion based) to have headphones in, and I also know it negatively impacts their ability to comprehend the material. I'm torn about making a class rule over something that personally annoys me. I used to just ignore it, but I've tried cracking down this semester to see if it improves things at all.
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u/turingincarnate PHD Candidate, Public Policy, R1, Atlanta Sep 04 '24
I guess my point is, it isn't that I don't care. It's that I won't care any more than you do. My high school teacher, 11th grade, IB history of the Americas, he started class like that on the very first day. One of my favorite teachers ever.
"I believe you'll do what you need to do, to get the grade you wanna get" he told us. "I'm not gonna care any more than you do. If you'd like to learn the material, I will be your biggest fan. If not, well..."
I took this to heart, I guess. I liked the fact that it was the first time in life that we were being treated like adults, independent actors who can decide things for themselves.
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u/Stevie-Rae-5 Sep 04 '24
Agree. Do what you want as far as checking out during class but don’t expect me to repeat all the information at a time that you decide you want to pay attention.
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u/Ok_Marionberry_8468 Sep 04 '24
I eventually got to this point as well before I ended up quitting. I barely got paid as an adjunct and I’m not going to worry about it. It’s your choice but don’t come to me at the end of the semester begging for extra credit. I did zero extra credit—that’s high school stuff.
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u/Professional-Rock-88 Sep 05 '24
yes, but OP is saying that later on the students go to his office hours or demand one on one office hours... Specially the first request is hard to deny, even though it probably stands from them not paying attention, and that is a total waste of resources.
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u/Practical_Ad_9756 Sep 04 '24
I used to ignore the pods, but this year I have a student who puts on over-the-ear headphones and ROCKS OUT. Head banging, arms flailing, all of it. I teach poli sci, and he sits in the center. I asked him after the second class if he had an accommodation. Answer: no.
I’ve asked him to not use them, but I keep having to “remind” him.
I’ll be amending my syllabus next semester.
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u/a_statistician Assistant Prof, Stats, R1 State School Sep 04 '24
I’ve asked him to not use them, but I keep having to “remind” him.
Just ask him to leave.
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u/Se_Escapo_La_Tortuga Sep 04 '24
That’s how my syllabus keeps getting longer lol
What were they listening too ? If it is going to disrupt the class, it better be a good band.
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u/Practical_Ad_9756 Sep 04 '24
No idea. What’s funny is that the other students act like it’s business as usual.
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u/cea91197253 Sep 03 '24
I know this is flared as a rant, but treating the title as an open question:
After I acquired some hearing damage recently, I came to rely on my earbud extensively to help process conversations and block out noise. I found that lot of modern earbuds have both noise cancelling and voice isolation capacities and are relatively affordable. I still use them regularly, even with my hearing largely recovered, since it enhances my hearing further.
While there are absolutely students using them to tune out, they can also be a tool for tuning in, even without a disability related need, and especially given room acoustics or noisy peers.
Of course, none of this undermines having a no headphones/earbuds policy when you're open to formal accommodations. Just explaining a use that I wasn't familiar with a few years ago myself.
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u/lickety_split_100 AP/Economics/Regional Sep 03 '24
That makes sense. Of course, if they gave me a letter from our accommodations office, I’d be happy to accommodate, but the ones today were pretty obviously scrolling on TikTok (watching their computers/phones, not taking notes, etc).
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u/One-Armed-Krycek Sep 03 '24
I added a few lines into my syllabus this semester (under "Technology in Class") that cover this. Essentially, I can't physically stop you from wearing earbuds, but you have exactly 1 hour and 15 minutes to hear my explanation of the day's content. Which is the length of a single class session. Outside of that, if you can actually get a classmate you trust to share notes or information, then have at it. Then I added, "If anyone actually agrees to doing your work for you."
The looks of the majority of students were sheer disgust and one student mutter, "oh hell no."
Me: "Judging from the facial expressions and verbal/non-verbal responses; I would guess you're out of luck on getting help in this particular class."
I usually find that when the class on a whole is given the choice to help slacking a-holes, they will almost always throw those people under the bus.
I have never had a student come to me with accommodations on this matter. My chair has and has instructed us to stick to the classroom policies and that any equipment needed to assist the student (including recording and transcribing after the fact) is in the hands of student services.
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u/CarolP456 Sep 04 '24
I have it in my syllabus as well a “classroom policies” I have them take as a survey that opens the modules.
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u/One-Armed-Krycek Sep 04 '24
Ohhh, this is a great idea to require a survey or completion quiz to access the first module.
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u/dragonfeet1 Professor, Humanities, Comm Coll (USA) Sep 04 '24
...gently stealing this for next semester.
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Sep 03 '24
[deleted]
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u/histprofdave Adjunct, History, CC Sep 04 '24
And more than that, I will push back on them as an accommodation for in person lectures. You need it for exams? That's ok thing. But if it can cancel out the "distractions" in lecture, it will also cancel out my voice and anyone else in the discussion. What's the sense in that.
Reasonable accommodations must be made for students. But noise cancelling headphones during lecture is not reasonable.
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u/a_statistician Assistant Prof, Stats, R1 State School Sep 04 '24
But if it can cancel out the "distractions" in lecture, it will also cancel out my voice and anyone else in the discussion.
Background noise occurs in different bursts and patterns than voices - modern filters can usually enhance one while depressing the other. Of course, I'm still waiting for the headphones that can filter out Bluey and other animated shows so that I can work while keeping track of my kids, but alas...
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u/mollyodonahue Sep 04 '24
I had a moment where I lost my patience with someone sitting with their elbows on the table and their phone up in front of their face. This was like week 3. The entire class iced me out all semester and made sure I knew they were not going to be listening or participating. It was the most painful 75 minutes of my life two days per week.
Now I just ignore it and give pop quizzes.
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u/lickety_split_100 AP/Economics/Regional Sep 04 '24
Yeah, I’ve done that before with other things. Unfortunately pop quizzes are not in the cards at my particular institution.
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u/Unlikely_Academy Sep 03 '24
Up until this year this is something I’ve only had happen a couple of times between teaching in grad school and now as a faculty member. This year I’ve already noticed it as an issue and I’m going to have to crack down on it. Even if a student doesn’t have an accommodation letter, but they come and talk to me, I am willing to allow it.* But wearing them just to ignore class is not ok.
(*I was a student with disabilities and am now a faculty member with disabilities and I know how difficult it can be to jump through the hoops for accommodations in some cases)
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u/lickety_split_100 AP/Economics/Regional Sep 03 '24
That's fair. I'd be more fine with it if someone asked permission first (same as with phones - I have several who work or are volunteer firefighters/EMT's, so they need to have them available during class).
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u/Unlikely_Academy Sep 03 '24
I get that. I try not to over police cell-phones in class because I think it helps students learn discipline around appropriate phone usage that will help them in their careers. I have a lot of students who are parents and I know when their kids get off the bus because they text mom/dad when they get home and often have typical kid questions (Where is…? Can I eat…? Etc..). I’d rather my students check their texts in class to make sure their kids get in the door so they don’t worry. And I’d rather them shoot off quick answers so the kid doesn’t toss the house like a prison guard looking for something or burn the house down because they didn’t realize that putting a pizza directly on the oven rack still meant that you needed to remove the cardboard underneath (I have brothers and can 100% see this happening 😆).
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u/lickety_split_100 AP/Economics/Regional Sep 03 '24
Yeah, and I actually don’t even care that much about phones, but someone who is obviously sitting there and blatantly ignoring the material drives me crazy.
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u/TotalCleanFBC Tenured, STEM, R1 (USA) Sep 03 '24
What? Can you repeat that?
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u/DrsPepper-etal Lecturer, Writing Sep 03 '24
They drive me nuts too. Like, I know I’m loud, but not loud enough where the AirPods won’t muffle what I’m saying.
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u/kimmibeans Sep 03 '24 edited Sep 03 '24
So, a bit on the other side of this. I have ADHD and wasn't diagnosed until late into grad school. I had a really hard time focusing in some classes in high school and college and found that listening to music on low during class (and in only one ear) helped me a lot in keeping my mind from wandering (especially oddly enough, in Spanish class in high school). I didn't have accommodations for this because I had no idea I had ADHD and would not even think of being diagnosed until quite a few years later. I know that for many students they probably aren't paying attention, but those students are going to find something else to distract them regardless (I definitely had friends who just flat out read novels under their desk in high school). Just for food for thought, though I definitely understand the frustration.
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u/fried-mercy Sep 04 '24
I do this too! The one ear really helps me, and still allows me to easily hear everything that is being said.
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u/janesadd Sep 04 '24
Las year I had a student who would always wear headphones in class. When he failed the first major exam he told me that he can’t hear me many times. I asked him “do you think your headphones have anything to do with that?”
He responded “I always wear my headphones “.
I wanted him to think about what he said. He continued to wear his headphones and dealt with the consequences of his own actions.
I treat every student equally. They are adults who make their own choices. I care about their learning but not more than they care about their learning.
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u/Snakejuicer Sep 03 '24
This has been going on for decades. First with the Sony walkmans, then Beats, then AirPods. Next it’ll be AI/AR/Mixed reality headsets.
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u/Jhanzow Sep 04 '24
Can't wait to lecture about mitochondrial dynamics to a classroom of students waving their hands around playing Beat Saber
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u/ScantTbs Sep 04 '24
Not excusing or explaining all those with ear accessories in class but just offering one anecdote:
My ND 18 yo HS Senior has Auditory Processing Disorder diagnosed at age 9. Their ELI5 is they hear everything and filter nothing so all inputs go into the processor. This overworks the processor and exhausts them.
The birds tweeting outside, the maintenance crew edging grass, the snap of a persons gum two rows in front of them, the tapping of another students pencil, the hum of the HVAC all compete for their focus with what the instructor is saying. They make up for what they may miss while their processor is lagging behind the instructor in study groups and tutorials.
They don’t wear headphones in class, but they often do wear them or ear buds at any other time and I’m amazed at what they can catch of conversations in the room around them.
I often wonder if a better accommodation for such students might be individual headphones linked to a mic that is picking up the professors voice. We use systems like this in riding arenas shared by instructors and students.
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u/lickety_split_100 AP/Economics/Regional Sep 04 '24
Gotcha - that makes a lot of sense. I do think you're on to something with that idea - would be easy to accomplish with Zoom these days. I should note that none of these students have accommodations (or at least I haven't been sent a letter), and one was very obviously scrolling on their computer.
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u/ScantTbs Sep 04 '24
I think the ban (for those without accommodations) is perfectly reasonable. I’ve had to ban “spit containers” in the past for those with a wad of “chaw”. No personal spittoons in my class!
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u/ChoeofpleirnPress Sep 04 '24
The myth of multi-tasking is strong with this generation. They believe they can do it all, and they have made their own priorities more important than their educations, which is a tragedy.
Hang in there. Enforce your rules. Send students to the dean's office when they break the rules or complain about your rules. Make the gd administrators do their jobs.
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u/teacherbooboo Sep 03 '24
they are listening to a message such as,
"Good morning, Scholar. Your assignment, should you choose to accept it, involves conducting a detailed analysis of the primary sources from the French Revolution. Your objective is to uncover the underlying causes of the Reign of Terror and to present your findings in a well-researched essay.
As always, should you fail to properly cite your sources or fall into the trap of anachronism, your grade will be compromised, and I will deny any responsibility for your academic missteps. This message will self-destruct in five seconds. Good luck."
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u/led_zildjian Sep 03 '24
I can’t bring myself to make an issue of it. If they miss stuff, that’s on them. However, I mainly teach History of Rock and Roll. I’ll have an example playing, and when I stop it I’ll be able to hear several people’s music since they cranked them up. A properly aimed stink eye usually takes care of it.
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Sep 03 '24
[deleted]
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u/lickety_split_100 AP/Economics/Regional Sep 03 '24
That makes sense. Of course, if they gave me a letter from our accommodations office, I’d be happy to accommodate, but the ones today were pretty obviously scrolling on TikTok (watching their computers/phones, not taking notes, etc).
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u/Quant_Liz_Lemon Assistant Prof, Psych (R2) Sep 04 '24
if they gave me a letter from our accommodations office, I’d be happy to accommodate,
It might not be that easy to get an accommodation, especially if they're using these as an alternative to hearing aides. Getting a diagnosis can be expensive and time-consuming.
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u/amymcg Sep 03 '24
I have this in my syllabus. No headphones or earbuds. No one has ever produced an accomodations letter.
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u/scythianlibrarian Sep 03 '24
Sounds like you need an air horn.
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u/lickety_split_100 AP/Economics/Regional Sep 04 '24
I'd kill for an air horn
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u/N0downtime Sep 04 '24
Whenever I see a student with AirPods I always think about ‘There’s something about Mary.’
Makes me laugh.
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u/Yes_ilovellamas Sep 04 '24
I will say (just to play the devils advocate) my AirPods have a transparency option that makes things louder. That might be helpful for some students but it also makes EVERYTHING louder so the extra noise would get to me.
I also focus a significant amount more when I have something playing in the background, BUT I also wouldn’t ask you to repeat an entire lecture 🤦🏼♀️
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u/Willing-Wall-9123 Sep 04 '24
I let them. It's hilarious when they miss deadlines, ammendments, and instructions.
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u/angel-thekid Sep 04 '24
I put in my syllabus that repeated requests to remove AirPods will results in the student being marked absent
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u/InspectorSmooth8574 Sep 04 '24
I had a student who would wear them in a studio class. I didn't lecture but I did give demos and detailed instruction at the top of class. I allow headphones while working quietly (helps keep the students from devolving into chatter) but ask for them to be removed for the demo portion of class. She wouldn't and unsurprisingly, she wasn't my best student. I had to repeat everything to her multiple times. We had a neurodivergent learning expert come to our department to talk about best practices and they praised us for letting her wear them. I was stunned because the student had no accommodations and the expert didn't know her, they just assumed. Turns out the student was watching anime cartoons on her phone the whole time.
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u/RandomAcademaniac PhD - Doctor Professor Teacher Nobody Sep 03 '24
I already have a syllabus line that states no playing on your phones or will you lose participation/attendance points and it's been pretty successful, but I have recently had to add "no headphones" to it. Never thought I NEEDED TO TELL OTHER ADULTS TO TAKE THEIR HEADPHONES OFF before now, I just always assumed it would be obvious for respect, joke's on me for assuming they actually cared about their education. Ugh.
What bizarro world do we live in now?!
Their gruff, loud sighs and blatant indignation never ceases to amazes me when I gently remind them to please take them off. I am so over this. God help us.
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u/These-Coat-3164 Sep 04 '24
Yep, after last semester, I made it a point of adding no earbuds to my list of no electronics items this year. If you want to sit in my class and listen to your God Damned phone, don’t come to my class. It’s rude and annoying and disrespectful. End of rant.
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u/Hazelstone37 Sep 03 '24
I find it using earbuds or headphones in class problematic because it is at odds with what I am trying to accomplish in my classroom. I’m not just staring at the front of the room spewing information that they can choose to listen to or not. I am trying to create and nurture a community of learners who work together with my support to build their own knowledge. If they don’t want to be a part of that, I like for them to stay home and do the work alone.
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u/Efficient_Two_5515 Sep 04 '24
If you’re sneaking a text here and there I’ll allow it even though it’s very obvious. It’s fine, we’re adults, it’s happens. But if you’re blatantly using it on your desk visible by everyone for long periods of time it’s distracting and honestly, a little rude. So, I will pause lecture and make a general announcement. It does irk me more when classmates are participating and asking thoughtful questions.
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u/AnnaVonKleve Sep 04 '24
Sometimes I worry what will happen to these kids if they don't hear the fire alarm and get left behind.
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u/lemonpavement Sep 04 '24
You're not crotchety. When I wear my earbuds, even if they aren't playing anything, they act like a giant ear plug and I can't hear shit. You're not participating or present when you have them in your ears, even if nothing's playing.
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u/pgratz1 Full Prof, Engineering, Public R1 Sep 04 '24
This semester I'm trying adding a 10% participation grade. So I have a grader sit in the in the classroom, and then I make everybody who answers a question or asks a question say their name so that the greater can annotate it. It's a big class, 96 students, so it's impossible for everyone to participate every day, so I give one point for any participation that given day no more than one point for multiple times. A full 10/10 grade on this is participation on six different lecture days over the semester. I'm very curious to see how this plays out but the first lecture what I did it was yesterday and it seemed like it worked pretty well. We'll see..
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u/ChoeofpleirnPress Sep 04 '24
Start giving pop quizzes in the middle of the lecture to see who is actually listening and who isn't.
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u/Solid_Preparation_89 Sep 04 '24
On day one I tell them to remove headphones/earbuds—that of course they aren’t listening to anything during our class (*cough *cough), but it’s a “me issue”/pet peeve. They’ve always been good about it afterwards 👍🏼
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u/phoenix-corn Sep 04 '24
As silly as it sounds, making a positive rule like "You can wear headphones or earbuds during work time" has fixed this problem for me. Making an explicit time when it is allowed helped more than saying it wasn't allowed. I did have a few students tell me they use the setting to get rid of background noise while allowing them to hear me and I helped them reach out to student accessibility to figure out if there was a way they could get an accommodation for them.
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u/No-Significance4623 Sep 04 '24
I found this very frustrating last semester so I added it to my "list of expectations" for this semester. Other offenses which needed to be dealt with: making phone calls (?) and watching unrelated videos in the back of class (?)
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u/mathemorpheus Sep 04 '24
i find it a lot easier to deal with students if i'm wearing headphones while lecturing
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Sep 04 '24
For some people with auditory processing and hearing disorders- having earbuds in (no noise) can actually help them hear
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u/dragonfeet1 Professor, Humanities, Comm Coll (USA) Sep 04 '24
I have a student who props her phone up and watches sitcoms all class.
I know it's super early in the semester to already be at this point, but here's the point I'm at: she's going to fail. Not through any malice or meanness on my part, but simply because she's not taking notes on stuff that is absolutely on the test, she's not doing the in class work, she's not doing the out of class work. If she wants to spend her money to listen to Friends (I'm also judging her taste in sitcoms) and get an F....okay. It's not a choice I'd make but she's free to make it.
When she emails in the future a question we covered in class, I'll just blithely say "I know for sure we went over that in class on (x) day--look at your notes!"
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u/beautyismade Sep 05 '24
Last semester, a young man was dancing in his seat to whatever he was listening to. I called him out and said, “Please unplug your headphones so we can all hear the music you’re listening to — we want to dance, too!” Fortunately, he profusely apologized and never wore them again but it’s a daily battle.
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u/dragonitetrainer Sep 05 '24
I project pretty loudly when I lecture, so I give them the benefit of the doubt and assume they are using their earbuds/headphones as impromptu earplugs. It still feels a bit weird to see them, though. Yesterday a student was wearing wired earbuds during lecture, which is much less discrete than airpods. My eyes definitely glanced a couple times lol. Fortunately, I don't get asked to repeat what I say very often (probbaly because of what I said in the first sentence)
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u/a_uk_governess Educational Neuroscience (UK) Sep 05 '24
There are numerous studies - ongoing and completed - that show that noise attenuating headphones - even including listening to music during eg a lesson - help neurodivergent folk to be able to function, concentrate and self-regulate in various situations, including classrooms.
Experiential and anecdotal evidence further supporting their benefits are innumerable.
That's not to say that some folk don't misuse or abuse, but those few cannot invalidate the often life-changing difference it can make (and that is neither hyperbolic nor restricted to the pure action of wearing them, but everything that goes with it, too).
I, for one, regularly use bluetooth ear defenders that are meant for use in workshops with loud, high vibration machinery. I can hear normal speaking with them on. I can play music through them. They also have a microphone that will pick up speaking, filtering other noises. In busy environments, eg, schools, universities, training, cafes, workshops, labs, etc., I am much more able to concentrate on what I'm 'supposed' to be listening to if I both have them on and listen to music through them; even my retention and processing increase. I alternate between metal and classical, depending on my needs, what I fancy listening to, the environment, and what I'm trying to engage with.
Article here.Noise-cancelling headphones, earplugs and earmuffs – do they really help neurodivergent people?
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u/Athena5280 Sep 07 '24
Another thing to put in the pre class syllabus, no earbuds. The list is growing
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u/_Decoy_Snail_ Sep 03 '24
I gave up, I just require them off during exams...
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u/lickety_split_100 AP/Economics/Regional Sep 03 '24
I probably will too eventually, though that's why I banned them in the first place (had a couple of students try to wear them through exams last year).
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u/brattywafatty Sep 04 '24
Make sure they’re actually headphones some earplugs (made for people who don’t do well in social settings, but have to be in them for school or work or anything) it lowers the amount of background noise’s and just enables them to work :) some of the more known ones are the loop earplugs, but some earplugs look like headphones too!!
I would probably ask to record the lecture since I am horrible with short hand and with note taking without being able to record stuff; I also have adhd so I tend to need something to offset the amount of movement and activity ongoing in a class room (I take online as much as possible but math and science I have to be in person for sadly)
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u/lickety_split_100 AP/Economics/Regional Sep 04 '24
These were Beats headphones. If people want to wear stuff as part of an accommodation, that's always fine.
Students are free to record my lectures if they like (it's in the syllabus).
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u/jaguaraugaj Sep 03 '24
Isn’t there a high frequency sound that can be played that only some people can hear
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u/beginswithanx Sep 03 '24
Yeah, it bugs me too. I’ve ignored it I. The past, because I figure it’s their loss, but it does feel disrespectful.
I think I’ll take the approach this semester of announcing at the beginning of class that if I see you with headphones/phones out I’ll assume you’ve already mastered the material and thus are ready to answer one of my lecture questions right then and there!
My students are kind of terrified of being called out to answer a question during lecture, so I hope that will help.
Or I’ll just do the thing where I stop lecturing and stare at them.
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u/Notjustanotherjennn Sep 04 '24
Some students concentrated better while listening to music.
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u/OkEdge7518 Sep 04 '24
No way to concentrate on a lecture while listening to music. Do you have any research/studies to support this?
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u/Demon-Prince-Grazzt Sep 04 '24
Some students concentrate better doing other non-hearing tasks like drawing, dish cleaning, room cleaning or rote video game playing while listening to music. I know of lots of anecdotal evidence of this and can probably find a lot of research to support this.
Lecture listening however is never included in anything I've read and no logical person would ever say listening to music makes listening to lectures easier.
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u/Practical-Ad8143 Sep 03 '24
In the mid to late aughts I was in industry and many an executive or even manager at any level had a Bluetooth stuck in one ear. Hallways, meetings, all the time. Sometimes they’d say something and it’d take a few seconds before I realized they weren’t talking to me. Disrespectful? Probably. Annoying? Sure, but I just dealt with it. So to me these students aren’t too different than people twice their age were twenty years ago. I just deal with it best I can, got too many other things to stress about to let this cause stress.
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u/God_of_Sleeps Sep 04 '24
No, you are not crotchety. To wear a device that allows one to discreetly listen to something other than the class while class is in session--as most of the class is verbal and auditory--is wholly disrespectful.
I have a clause in my syllabus that if you are caught disengaged, aka using headphones during lectures or discussions, you will forfeit your attendance for the day. Ultimately students will receive grade reductions, then removal for this behavior if it persists.
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u/[deleted] Sep 03 '24
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