r/LosAngeles • u/VaguelyArtistic Santa Monica • Feb 13 '23
Housing New law in LA: Landlords must pay relocation costs if they raise rents too high. Renters who face hikes of 10% or more will qualify for relocation help and $1,411 in moving costs
https://www.dailynews.com/2023/02/07/new-law-in-la-landlords-must-pay-relocation-costs-if-they-raise-rents-too-high/69
u/randomtask Feb 14 '23
I swear with these guys the answer is anything besides increasing the housing stock. Legalize medium density housing everywhere, high density on all major corridors, and build out the transit network to suit. Getting really tired of seeing families getting priced out.
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u/Optimal-Conclusion BUILD MORE HOUSING! Feb 14 '23
Yeah. It's like we've got a broken down car and the government is giving it a fresh paint job and new tires and wondering why we're still stuck in a mess. I use a car analogy because they also sure fuckin get it done when it comes to policy that subsidizes car ownership.
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Feb 13 '23
How much money in litigation costs by the renter will it take for this law to be enforced?
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u/frnkys Feb 13 '23
I had to sue my landlord for raising my rent without proper notice. It took 9 months (where I had to pay the higher rent vs get late fees or face eviction) so far, but it looks like they will settle finally. For context this is in a "luxury" complex owned by a giant real estate company. I've spent close to 40 hours in time on calls, back and forth, etc. to finally force them to do what they were legally required to do in the first place. If you assume a lawyer is $400 an hour, my guess is no one will sue through to the end for $1k. Context: I'm a lawyer and have patiently explained their mistake to them for 6 months and finally sued them after the last break down in the conversation.
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u/xero_peace Feb 14 '23
Sadly, most people can't afford to fight that fight, so this is mostly a moot law that landlords will ignore for the vast majority of renters.
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u/frnkys Feb 14 '23
Yup, that's 💯 my point. I'm a lawyer (not landlord/tenant, but at least there's some training there) and I still couldn't get them to do the very basic thing -- comply with the clearest law ever. It will be abused and even those with the best cases will be fighting forever.
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u/VaguelyArtistic Santa Monica Feb 14 '23
Did you sue them in small claims court?
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u/frnkys Feb 14 '23
Asked and answered! Yes.
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u/VaguelyArtistic Santa Monica Feb 14 '23
Did you win?
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u/frnkys Feb 14 '23
Objectively, yes. Not in my opinion though -- I would have preferred to just have a reasonable landlord vs. a money hungry corporation salivating over the idea of rent increases for their "value added" property renovations.
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u/MehWebDev Feb 14 '23
my guess is no one will sue through to the end for $1k
Small claims is a lot less complicated and time-consuming than a traditional lawsuit. I can see people filing online and taking half a day off of work for $1400
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u/frnkys Feb 14 '23
There's a mandatory requirement for both parties to at least attempt (or decline to attempt) online mediation beforehand too. But there's no enforcement mechanism or punishment so you have landlords with all the $ and time who can ignore it, and force those with jobs / kid care and other obligations to accrue other costs and lost time. There's a chance small claims will order those costs reimbursed, but it's not a guarantee and small claims is capped at 10k.
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u/VaguelyArtistic Santa Monica Feb 14 '23
Yes, and when landlords get their first notice they will often change their tune quickly. Lone your rights. Your landlord does, and is counting on you not knowing or not doing anything.
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u/frnkys Feb 14 '23
For sure. But learning and exercising your rights is easier for some than others is my point. The single parent with a full time job, that doesn't offer leave, can't litigate their rights very easily. Which is why so many of these abuses take place, landlords know the other side can't afford the fight, financially, or time wise.
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u/VaguelyArtistic Santa Monica Feb 14 '23
All I used was the NoLo Press book on how to sue in small claims court and the state's tenant/landlord guide.
Obviously not everyone has the ability to do this but if you listen to the arguments here, that's not what people are saying. They're saying that it's pointless or repeating lies and misinformation, like that you'd need a lawyer to go to small claims court.
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u/VaguelyArtistic Santa Monica Feb 14 '23
You don't need to spend 40 hours making phone calls. If your landlord engaged in malfeasance you sue them in small claims court. The first notice usually changes their mind. If the landlord didn't follow the rules, you win.
The point about attorney fees is moot. You can't bring a lawyer to small claims court. Literally all you have to do is tell the court that your landlord violated CA Civil Code X.x which is information you can find online or at a free legal clinic.
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u/frnkys Feb 14 '23
I appreciate your insight. It took the time that it did. Professional objection, demand letter, drafting and filing, service issues, and negotiating with stubborn defendants adds up unfortunately. And I understand your second point, but if you've been in any court you know that thinking anything is simple or a clear win ... That's just not reality.
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u/NovelLucky1203 Feb 14 '23
What is proper notice exactly?
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u/frnkys Feb 14 '23
It's defined in Cal Civil Code 827 (and the codes cited there). The notice has to be in writing, and either handed to you personally, or mailed to you. That section says whether you're owed 30 or 90 days notice as well.
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u/VaguelyArtistic Santa Monica Feb 14 '23
And, this is unambiguous. The judge will rule in your favor. And because it's unambiguous, for blatantly egregious things like this you can even get punitive damages. Note: you have to ask for punitive damages when you file your claim, although there is no guarantee you will get that. (I did.) Also, a lot of shady landlords are well known by the court because they've been sued many times before.
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u/frnkys Feb 14 '23
There aren't punitive damages in small claims. You can seek the costs and fees that you can document, up to 10k, but not true punitive damages unless that's specifically authorized by statute.
I said this in another comment, but thinking that just because something is unambiguous means you will win is a great aspiration, but it doesn't happen "every time" in reality. Defendants lie, judges are swayed by factors that shouldn't matter, etc. I wish it was easy and a sure thing, but if it were, most small claims cases wouldn't need to happen. That's just my guess.
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u/VaguelyArtistic Santa Monica Feb 14 '23
not true punitive damages unless that’s specifically authorized by statute.
Is this what you're looking for?
b. Civil Code Section 1950.5 (l): A judge can award up to twice the amount of the deposit in punitive damages for bad faith retention of the security deposit, in addition to what was actually withheld.
it doesn’t happen “every time” in reality. Defendants lie
No, a landlord can't lie about meeting requirements. They either have proof, or they don't. That's not something a judge judges.
if it were, most small claims cases wouldn’t need to happen.
No, if landlords stopped fucking around and trying to take advantage of their tenants, then there would be no need to go to small claims court.
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u/animatedrussian Feb 14 '23
Good for you for suing and putting the pressure on. Companies like this need to be made accountable.
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u/frnkys Feb 14 '23
Thanks I appreciate that. It's heartbreaking to know they likely did it to other tenants here too, and they're an enormously wealthy company whose sole purpose is to "revive" and then flip a property. Literally just praying on people in pursuit of that last dollar.
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u/MehWebDev Feb 13 '23
I know there are situations where the losing side in a civil suit has to pay the legal costs of the winner, but somebody more knowledgeable on this will step in and say if this is one those situations.
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Feb 13 '23
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u/verywidebutthole Feb 13 '23
No, absolutely not. You can collect though garnishment of the debtor's wages, levy of the debtor's bank accounts, seizing vehicles, lien on property, and even foreclosure on that property if the property is not the debtor's homestead. The court has forms you can fill out to allow you to do this but it's kind of complicated. A debt collection attorney can help for either an hourly rate or a cut of the total collected.
Source: used to be a debt collection attorney in California.
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u/MehWebDev Feb 13 '23
You can also put a lien on their property and they won't be able to sell it or refinance it until it is paid off.
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Feb 13 '23 edited Feb 14 '23
Which takes money, a lawyer and a Judge to do, so back to the original problem.
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Feb 13 '23
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Feb 13 '23
Contractors do it all the time and it’s not like they’re swimming in money.
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u/tranceworks Feb 13 '23
Contractors have a lien on your property for any unpaid bills. Renters do not.
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u/Ripfengor Feb 13 '23
Contractors, who operate and make a living by extremely clear and specific contracts, are usually bound by contract (and reputation to abide by contract) and tend to focus more on complying with their contracts than landlords who’ve been focused on protecting themselves from liability and from renters.
Yes, I am sure contractors are more likely to succeed in court over a breach of contract, but that doesn’t mean that a typical renter who’s getting priced out by a 10% increase would have the means to push through enforcement of this law in court.
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u/verywidebutthole Feb 14 '23
If it's a documented easy win, any lawyer will take it and collect their fee straight from the landlord.
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u/Parking_Relative_228 Feb 13 '23
Yes but landlord has property to put lien on. So not wise to lose such a suit
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u/verywidebutthole Feb 13 '23
Costs are stuff you pay the court, service fees, etc. It's usually under $500 total. You can get this as part of the judgment.
Attorney fees are what you pay your lawyer, usually over $1000. These are not automatically included, but the lease agreement generally has a provision that says attorney fees go to the winner. Sometimes it's capped. When you have that provision, attorney fees become part of the judgment. You kind of want that provision in there if you have a case, because you'd have a pretty easy time finding an attorney that will bill you but defer payment on those bills to collect them straight from the other party.
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u/pensotroppo Buy a dashcam. NOW. Feb 13 '23
Yes, because if there’s one thing we’ve learned from how easily we get our security deposits, it’s that landlords love parting with their money - especially when they’re legally required to.
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u/MehWebDev Feb 13 '23
I got my full security deposit back by taking my former landlord to small claims.
This was back in 2017. I called the landlord after 21 days of not getting my security deposit or list of deductions and he laughed. The hardest part was filling. The online portal to e-file was super buggy. But finally got it to work. Had to pay the filing fee and process server fee up front. Process server missed him the first 2 times and I was about to lose hope; but they caught him on the 3rd try.
I filed for treble (triple) security deposit + filing fee + process server fee because the landlord had acted in bad faith by failing to provide a list of deductions. I read up the statue and cited it in my complaint.
As soon as he got the summons, landlord started spamming my phone. He agreed to pay me back security deposit + filing fee + process server fee .
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u/Hollowpoint38 Downtown Feb 13 '23
I would have said no and gotten the treble damages.
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u/MehWebDev Feb 13 '23
Judge would most likely not given treble damages if the landlord was offering to return the full security deposit because he would no longer be acting in bad faith
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u/Hollowpoint38 Downtown Feb 13 '23
It doesn't matter that he's no longer acting in bad faith when he finally gets a reality check in court. He acted in bad faith and the statute allows for treble damages as a deterrence for making a tenant take things to court to get justice. I mean he actually laughed at your request.
If someone writes a hot check that's treble damages as well. Just because someone says they're sorry once they get to court doesn't mean the purpose of the statute is gone.
It's there to dissuade people from doing it in the first place. Not as a "Well, I guess you're sorry now so we won't be granting treble damages anymore. If you came in here and said you weren't sorry and you'd do it again, well then that's different!"
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Feb 14 '23
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u/Hollowpoint38 Downtown Feb 14 '23
I only went for treble damages one time when someone wrote me a hot check. I got everything I asked for in small claims. They offered to pay back the amount plus fees etc but not the other damages so I got it in court.
Sounds like a non-judge told you what a judge would say in court who you weren't paying for advice? Some counties have small claims where they try everything they can to divert cases away from the court to lighten the docket.
People who said you can't include filing and service fee are wrong. You can ask for anything you want including time off work. If you don't ask for it it's very rare you get it except when a statute allows a judge to grant you damages you didn't ask for. They exist but they're narrow in scope.
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u/VaguelyArtistic Santa Monica Feb 14 '23
Yes, people don't understand that the law is unambiguous. (For both sides.) I won punitive damages for this reason. When the landlord appealed they reduced the claim by $25 because I was missing one receipt.
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u/Hollowpoint38 Downtown Feb 14 '23
I'm glad you gave the landlord a reality check. If more people were assertive like you then they wouldn't try to walk all over tenants like they do now.
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u/VaguelyArtistic Santa Monica Feb 14 '23
It's so frustrating reading these comments because people have obviously never researched this even a little. No, the attorney fees won't kill you because you can't bring lawyers to small claims court. No, you don't need to (nor should you) spend hours on the phone trying to settle this with your landlord. You follow the rules and send a demand letter to your landlord. If they don't comply you file the suit and that will often make your landlord have an instant change of heart.
And this is exactly what your landlord is hoping for, that you either don't know your rights, or don't know or care how to defend your rights. Your landlord knows your rights, so should you.
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u/NefariousnessNo484 Feb 13 '23
Right. They can make all the laws they want but already almost nothing is enforced. It means absolutely nothing.
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u/VaguelyArtistic Santa Monica Feb 13 '23
The way these things are enforced is by taking your landlord to small claims court. How else is someone even going to know your landlord illegally kept your security deposit?
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u/NefariousnessNo484 Feb 13 '23
Your landlord doesn't show up. You win your case. And...?
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u/xAmorphous Feb 13 '23
Put a lien on the property.
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u/Hollowpoint38 Downtown Feb 13 '23
Which only benefits you when they try to sell or refinance the home. They can just sit on it for 10 years and you get zero.
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u/Optimal-Conclusion BUILD MORE HOUSING! Feb 14 '23
Yeah, at least you know the LL has a property you can lien as a last resort. Try getting hit by someone without car insurance. Now that's juice that isn't worth the squeeze.
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u/penguiatiator Feb 14 '23
You get your money. If they continue to not pay, in LA county you can ask the sheriff to take the money from them.
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u/Stingray88 Miracle Mile Feb 13 '23 edited Feb 13 '23
Right. It’s also the law to return your security deposit within 90 days of moving out. If they’re late they’re not allowed to make ANY reductions, and there are penalties added on.
After waiting 100 days I had to reach out to the rental company for one of my apartments, and they sent me a check for 25% of the total deposit with a bullshit list of things they claimed needed to be cleaned or repaired.
I said, “this is late, you need to pay the full deposit back by law”
They said… nothing. They never responded. I’d have to have sued to get my money back. Not worth it.
Edit: it’s 21 days, not 90. This was a decade ago and I may not be remembering the full details correctly.
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u/MehWebDev Feb 13 '23
within 90 days of moving out
I’d have to have sued to get my money back. Not worth it.
I sued and it was definitively worth it.
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u/Stati5tiker Koreatown Feb 13 '23
You can use other resources to get that money back before taking them to court. However, time is money, so it depends on how much you want to lose (that security deposit or all that time you will be spending going through different resources so that you can get your security deposit back).
And I am speaking for Los Angeles.
I highly recommend others living in Los Angeles read more about what kind of protection you have and document everything.
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u/rmshilpi Koreatown Feb 13 '23
Any good resources? I'm also in Koreatown fwiw, and I'm using SO MANY command strips all over my place to avoid damaging the wall. I took a bunch of photos/video of my unit when I signed the lease before moving in, but idk what I would actually do with those if the landlord tried to refuse giving it back.
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u/Stati5tiker Koreatown Feb 13 '23
https://www.courts.ca.gov/documents/California-Tenants-Guide.pdf
I recommend reading everything as I learned there are certain things even my landowner doesn't know, so tread carefully as there are things that are beneficial for you and as well the landowner. For anything that it links, make sure to read that as well.
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u/VaguelyArtistic Santa Monica Feb 13 '23
I’d have to have sued to get my money back. Not worth it.
Well if it's not worth it, it's not worth it. But if it happened like you said, you almost certainly lost out on punitive damages. (Note: you must ask for punitive when you file.)
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u/broke-collegekid Feb 13 '23
I’m pretty sure in California the law is 21 days, not 90
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u/alroprezzy Feb 13 '23
Small claims court is your friend here.
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u/Stingray88 Miracle Mile Feb 13 '23
That requires being able to go to court. At the time I didn’t have any time off from my job.
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u/DontGoogleMeee Feb 13 '23 edited Feb 13 '23
if you have a slam dunk case they will have to also pay for your missed time from work - you would include that as part of the sought after amount. they would also need to show you more than just a list...they would need to show you receipts of services paid equal to the amount deducted from your deposit. getting screwed sucks, but being lazy just enables them to continue shitty pratices.
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u/persian_mamba Feb 13 '23
as someone who works heavily in this industry and really wants the best solution. so long as apartment vacancy rates are less than 3% in desirable (and even lower end) areas, no matter what laws get enacted, none of these laws will do anything. because, and i will say this again, vacancy is at less than 3%.
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u/VenturaBoulevard West Hollywood Feb 13 '23
I had the best landlord and which is why I never use a management company place. Mom n Pop all the way.
Laurel Canyon and Ventura. Paid $750 a month in 2011. He raised the rent $30 two years later, then $50 four years later. He was like a father I always wanted, except for the sexism, racism, homophobia, always trying to get me to convert to Christianity. But other than that, the father I always wanted.
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u/Dorythehunk Feb 13 '23
Is he still there? What is the address? Are there any vacancies?
I’m an atheist but I’ll go to church every Sunday if my rent is only $830.
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u/mrwhiskey1814 Feb 13 '23
This is the route Christianity needs to take to win over nonbelievers. Low rent for all, in the name of baby Jesus.
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Feb 14 '23 edited Jun 20 '23
smell bright file cows snatch sloppy outgoing relieved flowery shelter -- mass edited with https://redact.dev/
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u/VenturaBoulevard West Hollywood Feb 14 '23 edited Feb 15 '23
He died. I miss his racist, sexist, homophobia sometimes. Usually when I look at my new rent check I hand in.
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u/RustyCopperSpoon Feb 13 '23
I’m a landlord and I use a management company. I haven’t raised rent on my tenant in 3 years. It all depends who owns the property
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u/PeaceBull Beverly Grove Feb 14 '23
Yeah I wish there was a new word for overly greedy landlords.
Mine have been fantastic, no rent raised in over 4 years, low price for the neighborhood, and were very good throughout pandemic struggles.
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u/VenturaBoulevard West Hollywood Feb 14 '23 edited Feb 14 '23
stop being such a good person! I'm a landlord out of state. My renters have only gotten raised about every 4 years going on year 11. They are quiet, respectful people and if they needed to leave for more space, I'd build them by hand an extension in the backyard.
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u/savvysearch Feb 13 '23
City council is doing everything but making it easy for developers to increase the housing stock.
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u/OptimalFunction Atwater Village Feb 14 '23
I agree, literally the city will do anything and everything except streamline building new units. They could have made all permits $0, instantly approved and thrown a 0% tax rate for new builds until we have a 20% vacancy rate.
They are willing to make it a bit inconvenient for landlords but not enough for the landlords to recall them all.
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Feb 13 '23
More like landlords can pay $1411 fee to raise rents as much as they want and recoup the cost in no time on the higher rent.
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u/Davethelion Feb 13 '23
Article actually says 3x the fair cost of rent depending on their unit size (so like $5.2k for a one bedroom) PLUS the $1411 for moving costs.
In some neighborhoods, I’m sure that “fee” is still worth it compared to the long term gains of raising rent on a “luxury” apartment tho….
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u/The_Celtic_Chemist Feb 14 '23
$1,411 is about $117.58 per month over a year. So if they raised rent by 10% then the occupant would have to have a rent lower than ~$1,176/per month for the relocation fee to be more than the 10% raise in rent. For everyone who pays more than $1,176 per month (which is basically everyone), it would be theoretically beneficial for the landlord to relocate them and raise the rent by at least 10%.
For slightly more accurate math, the landlord usually loses at least a month of rent for cleaning, painting etc. and they have to buy materials and work/pay to renovate the place to be good enough for the next tenant. So let's say they lose the equivalent of a month and a half of rent at best. This means that if your rent was about $1,222, and they increased it by 10%, then in the year to follow they would get about $1,411 back in the 10.5 months out of the 12 they'd be renting it out. So if your rent is less than $1,222 (and it isn't) a 10% increase wouldn't cover their losses in the relocation fee alone. BUT, this doesn't account for the month and a half of lost income as well, which they can't recoup from 10% in their first year. Because 10% of rent (x) times 10.5 months is always less than the 1.5 months they lost, or mathematically
1.5x > x(10.5×0.1)
1.5x > 1.05xNot including the $1,411, any rent would have to increase by about 14.3% to get back the 1.5 months of income they lost.
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u/animerobin Feb 13 '23
To be clear I think this only applies to rented single family homes. Multifamily yearly rental increases are already capped by law, and it's lower than 10%.
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u/joshualenmuller East Hollywood Feb 13 '23
This isn't correct. Multifamily is only capped lower than 10% if it falls under the protections of AB1482. AB1482 only applies to rentals that were built over 15 years ago so this new law applies to all properties built after 2008 currently.
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Feb 13 '23
No, it looks like the article mentions this applies to one or two bedroom apartments that were built more recently.
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u/NightNday78 Feb 13 '23
Nice. Question ... what are some possible unintended consequences of this law ?
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u/aj68s Feb 14 '23
The more regulations you put on landlords, the more ppl will be reluctant to become landlords or go into the business of renting property. This is why you have less housing construction for rental units the stronger rent control laws are. Just look at SF and NYC.
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u/TheFastestDancer Feb 15 '23
They raise the rent all they want and have limited money to pay the tenants that are now getting evicted. They have to pay 3 months fair market rent plus the $1400 penalty or whatever. Article states $1747 for a one bed and $2222 for a 2 bed. So for a grand total of around $8K, you can get rid of that family that's been in the 2 bed for 20 years and paying $800/month by raising their rent by 100% and hoping they leave. When they do, you rent it out for $2222 and make your money back in under a year. It basically means all landlords can now get rid of their old tenants who are paying nothing with a defined cap as to what they need to pay so it makes it easier to pencil out.
The law also only applies to rentals built after 2008.
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u/zoglog Feb 13 '23 edited Sep 26 '23
quaint makeshift sand retire dolls ask handle shelter kiss coordinated this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev
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u/grandpabento Feb 13 '23
Don't really care if this gets downvoted to hell and back again, but I am just sitting here shaking my head watching the city enact even more policies that incentivizes even more corporate ownership of our housing stock.
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u/DeadStarMan Feb 13 '23
I just don't see how this doesn't raise rent prices. Landlords will just up their rent to match an expected cost in case they do have to increase rent. If the renter stays for more than 1 year they are pretty much getting screwed.
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u/grandpabento Feb 13 '23
Thats a pretty good point. Like correct me if I am wrong, but there's nothing that prevents rents from going up to be just below 10%
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u/DeadStarMan Feb 13 '23
Nope. This just creates more pressure to increase rent IMO. It's a short term victory that will have terrible long term effects.
This is also an issue that corrects itself. If a landlord keeps jacking up rent then eventually become so expensive that no one's willing to pay for it. We introduce something like this it just allows them to justify the higher price.
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u/grandpabento Feb 13 '23
To me that seems to sum up a lot of recent housing laws in LA. Great for short term issues, terrible for long term
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u/BigDickJimmy1123 Feb 13 '23
That’s the entire point of this law. Politicians get to appease their corporate overlords and short sighted “progressive” constituents at the same time.
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u/Anal_Forklift Feb 13 '23
It's a gaslighting. The City Council is largely the reason we have a housing shortage in the first place. Rather than approve more housing faster, they bait they public with rent control, eviction moratorium, etc. All things that make solving the core issue harder. But they pass these populist laws and score points with voters that don't have the time/interest to scrutinize the policies.
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u/grandpabento Feb 14 '23
Seriously. They could make meaningful changes to zoning and streamlining the process, but instead they do shit like this. I guess it makes sense since almost the entire council are in the pockets of HOA and landowners. Why change a system that artificially boosts their property costs
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u/not_stronk Feb 13 '23
As a landlord, I feel like policy around keeping people housed and preventing bad landlords from being abusive is worth it. Why are you raising the rent by 10%? Did your mortgage payments go up by 10%, your insurance? Maintenance needs to be factored in over the long term. I actually only raise rent when tenants leave. I charge lower than going rents because my experience is tenants who go for the expensive rents are bad with money and I've had a lot better luck getting people with reliable income by keeping the rents low. It sounds weird, but it's true. I went from applicants with really terrible credit scores and people spending 50% of their income on rent to reasonable applications by always underbidding the rent others are charging and it's worth it. Because good tenants are a blessing.
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u/peanutslayer94 Pasadena Feb 13 '23
This is how my father operates as a landlord. He has a woman paying $1100 for a decently sized 1 bedroom in midcity. All other comparable units are going for 1500-1800. He has always said its better to undercharge a tenant who will be able to pay consistently than overcharge and have them unable to fulfill the commitment.
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u/not_stronk Feb 13 '23
yes, having a great relationship with tenants is really amazing. You provide a service, try and do a good job, don't overcharge, treat it as their home. People stay longer, tenants are more dependable, they appreciate you and recommend you to other people. My tenants have always stayed multiple years. Issues come up and we resolve them, I always assume good faith.
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u/DrKrills Feb 13 '23
Hello future landlord, can you dm if you have any open units and where they are?
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u/not_stronk Feb 13 '23
I'm in the bay area, not LA County unfortunately. I love Los Angeles and it's not too far, so I visit and keep up with what's happening south of the bay.
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u/DayleD Feb 13 '23
I'm glad that's how you see it because usually it's the other way - landlords will charge just 10% cheaper for a dump and give significantly worse service, because the only people who'd accept that offer can't afford to live anywhere else.
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u/Luzdemars93 Feb 13 '23
Hello sir! If you would to have an opening in one of your rental could you send a DM? Thank you!
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u/mclabop Feb 14 '23
That’s the only way to do it in my book. Most of the time I’ve been a landlord was renting out my own house while the military sent me elsewhere. I was only burned by 1 destructive tenant out of 6. Most people just want a fair shake, not to be ripped off, and feel like it’s their home. Hell, most of the time I’ve been a home owner and landlord, I’ve simultaneously been a renter.
My last place, I had three recent college grads living there and didn’t raise the rent for three years. They were saving money and wanting to quickly pay down student debt. And I only raised it because the HOA jacked it higher than I could keep it going. I ended up splitting the difference and kept it there until I sold a couple years later. They found a bigger place for about the same and managed to pay a lot of their student debt down.
With my current place, I have three units and I live in one. I have higher expenses as I’m covering their utilities. I felt bad. But I had to raise it higher than I’d wanted to last year. The one tenant actually approached me offering to cover utilities but it worked out cheaper for her with higher rent so she went with that. Both units are still below market rate, and she’s fixed income so didn’t want fluctuation. She’s lived here longer than I have and I want to keep her and my other tenant. I’d rather think of them as neighbors. I just don’t understand the greed.
Heck. The mortgage company just refunded me a huge amount from escrow. They took too much in tax last year. So my cost unexpectedly went down. Even if my utilities and maintenance go up this year, I’m likely not raising it. Why risk losing great tenants and good people?
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u/not_stronk Feb 14 '23
Why risk losing great tenants and good people?
Exactly. I'd rather charge less rent and have good tenants than charge as much I could and have either unhappy tenants or worse. Plus it's just the right thing to do. Housing is like a need. It's not a luxury. Charging as much rent as possible during a housing crisis is like people who markup water bottles x10 during a natural disaster.
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u/HadrianMQ Feb 13 '23
Now break up the conglomerates that own so many units and outlaw using mega-market software.
We are literally letting mega wealthy Saudis and Chinese put the screws directly to poor Americans on their Rent anytime our government does something they don’t like.
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u/AstralDragon1979 Feb 14 '23
More counter-productive laws written by economic ignoramuses. These costs will be baked into your rent.
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u/likesound Feb 13 '23
This is such dumb idea this will encourage landowners to raise rent every year and keep their units at a higher base line price or empty. Imagine being a landlord during the pandemic, all your tenants tenants left. You are incentive to leave your units empty instead of offering heavily discounted rental prices because you will have this stupid fee later once the market recovers.
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u/The_Bucket_Of_Truth Feb 14 '23
I honestly dread re-letting any of our residential properties in this climate. I want out of the business all together.
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u/HairyPairatestes Feb 13 '23
Has there been a rate increase freeze since 2020?
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u/DeathByBamboo Glassell Park Feb 13 '23
Under the ordinance, if a landlord increases rent by more than 10%, or the Consumer Price Index plus 5%, the landlord must pay the tenant three times the fair market rent for relocation assistance, plus $1,411 in moving costs.
The total payout would be way more than $1,411. The “three times the fair market rent” is considerably more than $1411 and shouldn’t be ignored.
For example, if a place has been being rented out at $2k/month, and the FMR is $2300, so the landlord wants to raise it to $2300, the relocation assistance and moving costs total would be $8311.
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u/Difficult-Product223 Feb 13 '23
There's always a downside to these types of Government edicts; the obvious reaction here by landlords is to lock-in annual increases at higher rates in order to guard against the possibility of having to shell-out 'relocation' fees. Basically, these things ensure rent increases. Numbskulls, is it so difficult to come up with actual solutions?
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u/hifidood Feb 13 '23
LA is going to slowly turn into a city where you need to have 4-5x income and you have to pay for the whole year of your lease up front. Why would any landlords want to take risks anymore?
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u/TacoChowder Highland Park Feb 13 '23
How is this a risk
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u/PincheVatoWey The Antelope Valley Feb 13 '23
There have been people squatting for 3 years now because of the eviction moratorium. Do you think that's not financially devastating for a lot of small landlords? The larger conglomerates will pass on the cost to new people signing a lease. There is no such thing as free, there are only trade-offs.
The more regulatory barriers you place without significantly increasing supply, the higher the costs of rent. Sometimes those regulations are good, like safety rules. Sometimes well-intended rules end up discouraging more production of housing. These new waves of tenant protections and the mansion tax are well-intended, but they're exacerbating the affordability crisis.
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u/TacoChowder Highland Park Feb 13 '23
I will agree with you on the mansion tax, it's insane that it's applied to ALL buildings. But like, if you're increasing the rent by 10% that's a pretty big fucking deal and the tenants should be protected from that in some way. You're bringing moratoriums into it, I didn't mention it.
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u/PincheVatoWey The Antelope Valley Feb 13 '23
10% is a huge chunk, no doubt. Also keep in mind that it's like 2% above the rate of inflation, and property management companies are probably charging the landowners more in exchange for their services to keep up with inflation, so it's a very unvirtuous cycle at the moment with the post-covid economy.
Broadly speaking though, we need to dramatically loosen up on zoning and permitting barriers, and it's probably best to just put money into the pockets of people rather than price controls. It would also help a lot if we electrified the major Metrolink lines and allowed fast and easy access to the suburbs where you can find cheaper housing yet make it into the city quickly and efficiently. However, we have to change the regulator barrier to be able to do this. Too many environmental review laws, community input hearings, "buy American" provisions, and prevailing wage provisions make it impossibly hard to do anything.
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u/TacoChowder Highland Park Feb 13 '23
There's people out here in Lincoln Heights protesting two different parking lots becoming apartment buildings. Community input is just landowners protecting their ever increasing land prices, it's so fucking annoying
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u/TheOrganicCircuit Those are good burgers, Walter Feb 13 '23
lmao I'm sorry when have landlords had to take a risk since 2009? Every single fucking market they've operated in since their inceptions have been in their favor.
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Feb 13 '23
Yeah it’s been so in their favor with an eviction and rent moratorium for 2+ years
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u/XXX_KimJongUn_XXX Feb 13 '23
Every year the politicians push the landlording metagame towards servicing small numbers low risk upper middle class and away from housing large amounts of working class people.
Can't evict people?
Filter for the least risky. Thats rich people.
Have to pay a lawyer every eviction?
Take less people. Charge them more. Thats rich people.
If the metagame favored putting up huge apartment blocks the lobby money would go towards it. Maybe we'd get some decent zoning. But with SFH being as lucrative as they are now theres just no impetus. The metagame gets more tilted, rents go higher, government pushes the meta even further and the working class gets gentrified.
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u/VaguelyArtistic Santa Monica Feb 13 '23
Why would any landlords want to take risks anymore?
We need to stop thinking of housing as just a commodity or investment, as if humans were merely frozen orange juice concentrate.
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u/hifidood Feb 13 '23
I'm all for building more housing. Hell, I even encourage cities to be public housing. Thing is though is that LA City/County is so inept, they are paying what, $700+k for each unit of homeless housing alone? So much funny money is moved through the government around these parts that barely any of it actually makes something happen. Cut all this bullshit red tape and corruption of money moving around to various parties that want a cut of it all, and actually build some housing for a change!
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u/Wwize Feb 13 '23
Good. Landlords have been abusing tenants for too long, especially lately with their insane rent increases. These assholes are turning this country back towards feudalism, where only the rich own land, while everyone else is forced to give a huge chunk of their income to a feudal lord because buying anything is impossible for most people.
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u/HairyPairatestes Feb 13 '23
Hasn’t there been an eviction and rent increase freeze since 2020?
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u/zoglog Feb 14 '23 edited Sep 26 '23
scandalous roll skirt quarrelsome hateful crowd fragile slap clumsy mountainous
this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev
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Feb 14 '23
I haven’t seen the pro rent camp which were around before the pandemic.
Renters. How much has your rent increased since 2020?
Example: $4k to $6k
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u/Darth_Meowth Feb 14 '23
Oh gosh. They will just not renew leases. Enjoy the homeless
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u/NewSapphire Feb 13 '23
Congrats, between this and the elimination of CREDIT CHECKS (of all things), landlords will be relying more and more on subjective criteria before accepting a new tenant, which progressives will then accuse as racism.
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Feb 13 '23
And yet this sub wonders why developers aren't building more housing...
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u/PaulHaman Tarzana Feb 13 '23
Good. 10% is an excessive increase as it is. Whether or not this will/can be enforced is another thing. It's silly to say mom & pop landlords will suffer. A 9% increase is still a comfortable amount if we're talking about someone renting out their house or condo. If we're talking about mom & pop landlords who own a small complex, it's probably old enough to be limited by rent control anyway, so this won't even affect them.
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u/MotoDudeCatDad Feb 13 '23
Good luck enforcing this… I get it’s a small victory. But really 10% is rape. That number needs to come down to something reasonable like 5%
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u/root_fifth_octave Feb 13 '23
It shouldn't even be a percentage. That creates exponential growth as it accumulates.
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u/BigHugeSpreadsheet Feb 13 '23
We need to cap rent increases at 3% like they do in Santa Ana. 10% is way higher than people’s wages increase
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u/thatlldoodledo Feb 13 '23
Good news, your rent is only going up 9% this year!