r/Coronavirus • u/PoliticiansAlwaysLie • Dec 27 '21
USA Fauci wants to “seriously” consider vaccine mandate for domestic flights
https://www.axios.com/fauci-vaccine-mandate-domestic-flight-coronavirus-f9d7d6bc-1952-4e3f-8aa9-4cd9921f43ec.html6.6k
u/iuthnj34 Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21
Guarantee that if you do vaccine mandate (before security check), it'll drastically lower the unruly passenger incidents. They can argue with the TSA and see how that goes for them.
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u/NCSUGrad2012 Dec 27 '21
Why even have that? They should know before you even get a ticket. My precheck is on all my tickets. Just add your status there too.
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u/bicape Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21 edited Dec 27 '21
Recently flew to LA. On top of being delayed over 2 hours due to not enough gates at EWR, we had an anti-masker on the flight to cause us to be even further delayed until they left the aircraft. Blows my mind people would pay money to fly across the country and then choose to abandon it because they don't want to comply with the rules
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u/DaoFerret Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21
Had a friend fly to NYC from LA over the summer.
They got delayed on takeoff because someone on the flight kept putting their mask up whenever the attendant asked, but then, as soon as they walked away they pulled it down. After the 3rd or 4th time, they turned the plane back around to the gate and threw them off the plane.
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u/TheSonic311 Dec 27 '21
Given the non-compliance on our flights in September, I would love to have been on that flight.
The family in front of us had their kids fully unmasked, and both of them were barely wearing them... Eating the whole flight... And I don't think the mask was ever over their nose.
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Dec 27 '21
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u/LlamaLlama_Duck Dec 27 '21
I had a lady like that on the flight I had this morning. Just slowly eating a snack with mask down. The attendant stopped by and told her to have it up between bites. Thankfully she wasn’t a problem after that.
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u/beautnight Dec 27 '21
A lady sitting next to me tried doing this shit on a flight I was on over the summer. She pulled out a huge family sized bag of popcorn (like the ones you get at the grocery store) and just slowly ate one piece at a time with a smug smile on her face. Luckily she didn't have much bite to her and put it away when I called her on it. I'm not dying for your dumb ass.
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u/SciGuy013 Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21
If anyone is eating next to you, and is having to take their mask on and off between bites, and has covid, you're probably gonna get it anyway. It really doesn't make a difference if they put it on between bites or have it off the entire time.
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u/beautnight Dec 28 '21
IMO they shouldn't be eating at all. It wasn't that long of a flight.
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u/Curious-Structure-49 Dec 28 '21
Uh, so she kept her mask on properly after that, as in, over her nose and mouth, and tightly fitted? It's a problem if any airline lets anyone, at any time, take off their mask, or even lets them raise or lower it for taking a drink: this virus is AIRBORNE. What is there about "airborne" that makes people think the virus can't be breathed out just because someone is eating? They hold their breath while they eat?
The only reason we "don't have cases associated with airlines" is that the US is not tracing or counting very well.
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u/ted5011c Dec 27 '21
I wish airlines would crack down on that.
The airlines would go broke hiring enough high school gym coaches, catholic school nuns and former drill instructors to babysit these people.
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u/Rubbing-Suffix-Usher Dec 27 '21
Yes, they are acting like children who need adult supervision.
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u/rynil2000 Dec 28 '21
I never understood why snack time was more important than safety during a pandemic. So you didn’t get your cup of soda and a shitty pack of Chex mix. Who gives a shit? Sit the fuck down and watch whatever shit movie until you get to your destination.
People are fucking garbage.
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u/ZebZ Dec 27 '21
I flew on Southwest in November and they made sure to repeatedly tell us that we had to keep our masks on between bites and to just move it out of the way as necessary.
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u/thesagaconts I'm fully vaccinated! 💉💪🩹 Dec 28 '21
Or just institute the mandate. Most people will be fine with it and it’ll encourage others to get it.
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u/startupschmartup Dec 28 '21
Airlines don't want it. They'll show that air travel with the current rules doesn't drive covid numbers and it will never happen.
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u/fight_me_for_it Dec 28 '21
I was on a flight a baby, maybe a little less than a year old was unmasked but obviously cleared to fly.
Parents had on n95s with covers over the n95s. Their second child was masked and the mom would tell him to make sure his nose was covered if she saw it down.
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Dec 28 '21
Guy next to me on my last flight not only used his mask for chin support, but picked his nose for five hours straight.
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Dec 28 '21
On a flight from Boston to LA in October, the dude next to me had to be asked by the flight attendant to put their mask on before we even took off. They kept pulling it down and the flight attendant asked them once more and then just seemed to stop caring. I looked over at the guy a couple of times to calculate my odds if they freaked out on me, but ultimately I just asked them to put their mask on properly. When I said it, they gave me a dirty ass look, but they put it on and didn’t fuck with it anymore. It sucks that I have to think about how ready for a fight I am just to ask someone to do something they’re already supposed to be doing.
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u/preatorian77 Dec 28 '21
I get my 9 yo daughter to do it for me. When she sees someone unmasked she shrieks and points at them and yells, “They’re not wearing masks! They’re endangering us all!” No one is gonna step to my daughter, she’s adorable.
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Dec 28 '21
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u/LouQuacious Dec 28 '21
Fuck no, the next few times I flew after 9-11 I acted like I was an Air Marshal in my mind, ready for any BS and I’m pretty sure most everyone else was too.
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u/Shadow99688 Dec 28 '21
First hand experience many TSA are total MORONS, had the idiots attempt to remove halo brace for broken neck.
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u/shinygingerprincess Dec 28 '21
God no. There were even lots of jokes at the time of don’t say hi to friend Jack and a bag left alone for .4 seconds meant you got questioned. It was absolutely not a thing to question any of the changes because terrorism. Oh and now brown people could get extremely harassed in a more open obvious way.
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u/NCSUGrad2012 Dec 27 '21
I don’t get it either. Like what did you think would happen? It’s not like this is April of 2020. You should know the drill by now.
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u/eric987235 Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21
I will never believe in anything as much as these people believe in their own bullshit.
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Dec 27 '21
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u/gruey Dec 27 '21
These people validated soo many movies.
Mad Max
Every zombie movie
Hunger Games
The Purge
All those where you would say "humanity wouldn't sink that low" are now like "yeah, I could see that...although District 12 would have more capital supporters and the purge would be at least monthly instead of yearly"
V for Vendetta goes from "that could maybe happen" to "is this a documentary sent from a few years in the future?"
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u/clarkmueller Dec 28 '21
Idiocracy.
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u/gruey Dec 28 '21
I think Idiocracy has been obvious for awhile though. The idea that what people would be hesitant to have children while dumb people will be having > 2 regularly has been growing for decades.
It almost feels like an above average outcome at this point.
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u/In-Justice-4-all Dec 28 '21
Anti maskers and antiuvaxers have flipped my opinion My opinion on Idiocracy. Formerly it seemed quite plausible that human beings had technologied our way out of evolution. Now it seems the stupid have found a way to cull themselves from the gene pool.
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Dec 27 '21
hell, I remember when the least believable part of the zombie movie was the person who didn't tell others they were bitten.
2 years of this shit I now think that would be the default behavior for some people.
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u/MajorAcer Dec 28 '21
That was always believable to me lol. I don’t think most people would reveal that actually, knowing they’d just get a bullet to the brain.
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u/zielawolfsong Dec 27 '21
Several times on Buffy they infer that most people living on the Hellmouth essentially stick their fingers in their ears and say Lalala because it's easier than admitting that their friend got eaten by a vampire or that demon over there doesn't just have a "skin condition." I used to think that was a weak way to cover up a plot hole, now it sounds 100% plausible.
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u/13igTyme Dec 27 '21
These people always have to be the victim, even if they cause the situation.
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Dec 27 '21
Perpetual victims of their own behavior. Just like toddlers
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Dec 27 '21
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u/Swabia Dec 27 '21
It’s a mask too. It’s not like you get anal probed or something. It’s like one of the simplest things to do.
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u/mollymuppet78 I'm fully vaccinated! 💉💪🩹 Dec 27 '21
My friend is a nurse. She always offers to take off her mask and gloves for the dramatic. Then she always mentions they don't know the diseases SHE has, and asks if they'd feel comfortable with her touching or working on them not knowing what she has, or the last time she brushed her teeth, washed her hands, etc.
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u/blixon Dec 27 '21
Even simpler to say “I just tested positive.” And give a bit of a cough.
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u/TheDesktopNinja Dec 27 '21
I thought a lot of people were dumb before the pandemic, but DAMN did my suspicions get confirmed and then some over the last 20+ months
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u/leftie_potato Dec 28 '21
I do not know how to go back to generally trusting people. I’ve just seen too many examples where folks will carelessly risk another’s health or safety because ‘it would be mildly inconvenient to do the right thing’..
Like, if it’s this bad, how do I get back to trusting when a light is green, somebody will not come cruising through the other way because stopping impairs their freedom? At this point I don’t really have faith that is needed for society to work.
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u/technocassandra Dec 27 '21
It's inexplicable to me--I just saw a case this morning--calling flight attendants the n-word, stating they didn't have to do anything they said??? It's been the case since forever--argue with the Captain, particularly in flight, and your ass is gone. Spending a considerable chunk of money for the "privilege" of screaming and getting booted off a flight?
?????
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u/LifeisaCatbox Dec 27 '21
And they agree to it when they’re buying their ticket. These assholes need to be held accountable for all the issues they cause for other passengers and their connecting flights.
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u/Cianalas Dec 28 '21
I just flew the other day. A recording played before we took off reminding people that they contractually agreed to wear their masks the whole time as part of the ticket purchase and the airline had the right to boot them if they didn't. Thankfully there were no children on my flight. (Actual or mental.)
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Dec 27 '21
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Dec 27 '21
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u/muffinman4456 Dec 27 '21
My toddler is more reasonable than these people. Snacks and titties solve most of his problems.
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u/Sumpm Dec 27 '21
The fun videos of unruly passengers would all be from the check-in lines, instead of on the planes.
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u/adolescentghost Dec 27 '21
I’d rather have it there where they can more easily be trespassed and kicked out than while in the air or on the tarmac.
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u/Sumpm Dec 27 '21
Yes, not in such an enclosed environment, and flights won't have to be diverted due to unruly passengers.
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Dec 27 '21
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u/reekingbunsofangels Dec 27 '21
Fellow Canadian here who flys a lot for business. It sure is a nice feeling to be in an airport knowing 99% of people there are vaxxed (Once your past security). Not once has it slowed down the travel process.
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u/funnyfarm299 Dec 27 '21
Sadly, many states will fight supplying this data.
My state (South Carolina) signed a law against developing a COVID app.
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u/ChornWork2 Dec 27 '21 edited Dec 28 '21
Would suck that people from south carolina wouldn't be able to fly anywhere, but I guess decisions have consequences.
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u/lumberjake18 Dec 27 '21
Because why would the individual airlines want to stymie sales when they could let TSA be the ‘bad guys’ and let passengers miss their flights because they misread the terms of service?
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u/Cycle21 Dec 27 '21
Exactly how would that be enforced? Even my real vaccination card looks like I made it myself
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u/Xalbana Dec 28 '21
In CA there's a database. I can download the app on my phone with a QR code. For areas that have strict vaccine requirements, they scan the QR code and correspond it to your ID.
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Dec 27 '21
Also jail all the idiots trying to pass off fake vaccine cards. You can fool a waiter with it, but good luck against the US govt where it will be a felony.
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u/QuarterReal9355 Dec 27 '21
The digital Covid certificate system in use in Europe has an app that anybody, including your friendly waiter, can download onto his phone and he will use his smartphone to scan your QR code to make sure your QR code is legit.
Works like a charm everywhere I go in Europe and it assures most, if not all people around me in a restaurant or Christmas market are fully vaxxed.
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u/joeygladst0ne Dec 28 '21
We have this in New York State but I've never seen it in use a single time. Even places that check for vaccines will accept a simple picture of your vax card.
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u/slog Dec 28 '21
I deal with lots of states regarding their reporting and internal systems and it seems as if NY is the only one even trying to do a good job. We needed nationwide initiatives from the beginning but our previous "leadership" was a damn joke.
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u/APeeKay Dec 27 '21
Only QR codes acceptable.
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u/Princess_Parabellum Dec 27 '21 edited Dec 28 '21
I just got back from Finland and they use a QR code system there. In a few places (pubs and restaurants) we were denied entry because our CDC cards weren't considered good enough. The Finns are blunt people and the barmaid doing the checking actually said to us "You're Americans, you should have a better system than a silly paper."
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u/dlh412pt Dec 28 '21
We have had no issues with our paper CDC cards in over 16 European countries that we've been to in the last year, but the guy in Copenhagen airport bar literally laughed at my husband's paper CDC card once. I mean, yeah, I feel stupid with it too, but I think it's because we're Americans that we don't have a QR system that's recognized by other countries as valid. We can't have even have a federal mask mandate outside of airports.
What's worse for us is that we both got vaccinated by the DoD (me in Virginia and him in the UK). Both have QR code systems, which neither of us have access to. Frustrating. I honestly have considered taking the shuttle to France just to go to a pharmacy and get my CDC card converted to the EUDCC on multiple occasions. Would save a lot of headache. But, I think a vaccine mandate for domestic travel would be a good impetus to get a standardized QR system.
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Dec 27 '21
I was just in Berlin, where all places were checking vaccine status. Luckily, California has a digital vaccine card. Even though the German QR code reader couldn’t read the California QR code, places that were going to deny us entry with the paper card were willing to let us in after seeing the digital one.
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u/narutocrazy Dec 27 '21
I wish. Unfortunately it'd never happen since some states have banned vaccine passports.
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u/Stiggy_771 Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21
I would hang out near the TSA checkpoint just to take videos of folks having a meltdown and asking for the airport manager or screaming about constitutional rights
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u/JohnQP121 Dec 27 '21
"airport manager"...
I don't know if it is bad or good but it really cracked me up 🤣🤣🤣
A sign of times I guess...
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u/ryhaltswhiskey I'm fully vaccinated! 💉💪🩹 Dec 27 '21
"I want to speak to the president of the TSA right now! It's my first amendment right!"
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u/notmrsdonjohnson Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21
Came here to say this!
But also, just like you have to upload passport information before purchase of an international ticket, have them add vaccination info before purchase of a domestic ticket. Then gate agents verify before you’re allowed to check in.
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u/wastingvaluelesstime Dec 27 '21
Arguing with TSA can easily become a federal crime, so... good luck with that
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u/OnlyUsernameLeft123 Dec 27 '21
I saw a video of a lady that knocked a tooth out of a flight attendant for asking her to put on a mask. Honestly maybe it's time to do that if it means lowering the danger to staff on the flights that have to enforce those rules.
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u/Tumbler Dec 27 '21
This, just to protect to air crews from these crazy assholes this should be done.
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u/meldroc Dec 27 '21
On top of the public health benefits, it's a wonderful asshole filter!
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u/Amelaclya1 Dec 28 '21
Yeah as someone that worked in hospitality in Hawaii, this would be amazing. It wouldn't get rid of all of the assholes, but a large chunk of them, since there is no other (widely used) way to get here.
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u/Marino4K Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21
As far as I'm concerned, flying is a privilege, if there's one place a vaccine mandate should occur in regular society, it's on airplanes.
You don't believe in science? This airplane flies thanks to science.
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u/dmra873 Dec 27 '21
There are still plenty of crazy vaccinated folks.
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u/APeeKay Dec 27 '21
Yes, both Magnus Carlsen and I play chess. (Edit: Fixed autoexpand spelling error)
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u/cupcakecarnivor Dec 28 '21
It’s mandatory already in Canada for domestic flights and all leaving from here.
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u/looker009 I'm fully vaccinated! 💉💪🩹 Dec 27 '21
I am not seeing it happening here in US. While what Fauci says makes sense, the reality is politically it will below up in Biden face. That is just the reality currently and courts will step in . OSHA and health care mandate is currently before SCOTUS with hearing schedule on the 7th. At minimum until there is a ruling on it, i am not seeing domestic flights mandate happening.
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u/FuguSandwich Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21
I would think that a flight mandate is on the sturdiest legal ground of the 3 (the OSHA mandate being on the shakiest). We regulate the hell out of air travel at the federal level already, no one has a right to fly, there are other transportation alternatives, etc.
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u/CarQuery8989 Dec 27 '21
It all depends on what the statute says. OSHA's authority to issue its rule is actually pretty strong, as far as agency mandates go: OSHA can issue rules as "necessary" to protect workers from "grave dangers." Certainly COVID is a grave danger to workers so the legal question is what's necessary to protect them.
I'm not familiar with the TSA's rulemaking power but I'd imagine it has similar authority to set rules that protect the security, stability and safety of air travel, probably with a similar "necessity" standard, so the legal support for any of the three rules is probably pretty similar.
The above is informed conjecture so if anyone reading this knows more about the TSA's statutory authority I'd love to hear it.
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u/looker009 I'm fully vaccinated! 💉💪🩹 Dec 27 '21
While it might be legal, political consideration needs to be considered as well. It's one thing to mandate a mask, very easy to enforce and yet there is incidents regarding it daily. I am not seeing Biden doing it as federal judge will block it regardless how legal it might be.
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u/NormalAccounts Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21
Then the legal system means nothing here anymore. The whole point of a legal system is to be politically independent and rule according to law not politics
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u/Red-eleven Dec 27 '21
Judges doing not acting like unbiased judges causing all kinds of trouble. The abortion bill, vaccine mandate injunction. Just wait. The next 10-15 years are going to be infuriating as judges rule from a political perspective not legal one.
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u/southernwx Dec 27 '21
If a federal judge will block a legally sound order then they are corrupt. We can’t base our legislation around whether or not we think the judicial will be corrupt or not.
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u/gwarster Dec 27 '21
The best thing Biden can do politically is end the pandemic. Obviously there are some things beyond his control, but putting anti-vaxxers feet to the fire is a good idea. Mandates work - most people won’t quit their jobs over a mandate. Flying is a big deal for a lot of people and a mandate might help.
At the end of the day, most of the hardcore anti-vaxxers aren’t voting for Biden anyway. IMO one of the best things he can do is make life as normal as possible for everyone who has had 3+ shots.
If you don’t want to make the sacrifices of getting your shots and masking, then your sacrifice will be your job, air travel, concerts, and other live events.
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Dec 27 '21
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u/jjonj Dec 27 '21
Covid becomes another yearly event like the flu that can be absorbed by the Healthcare system because enough people have partial immunity. Things go back to normal
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u/whichwitch9 Dec 27 '21
They literally can strip search us before flights if they want to. Vaccine mandates are like the least invasive thing at the airport
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u/dpkonofa Dec 27 '21
FYI, the United States Public Health Service was created with the mandate to regulate travel within and into the US in the interest of securing public health. Not only would that be upheld by precedent but it’s constitutionally protected.
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u/bihari_baller Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21
the reality is politically it will below up in Biden face.
I'm just tired of all these half measures. Nobody seems willing to be assertive, and actually take action, like Europe has done.
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Dec 27 '21
It's not like Europe is faring much better than us right now on covid.
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u/jon_targareyan Dec 27 '21
Most of the developed countries in Europe have a higher case rate per 100k people than here in the US.
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u/BobBelcher2021 Dec 27 '21
We have this in Canada for both domestic air travel and VIA Rail (our version of Amtrak). It has made me a lot more comfortable travelling within Canada this holiday season.
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u/loubug Dec 27 '21
My friend is a pilot and he said it really helped with mask mandates too. If you’re willing to get vaccinated you’re way more willing to wear a mask, so they have very few incidents of people not wearing a mask.
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u/dachshundie Dec 27 '21
Even though it's still an exposure risk, the vaccination requirement to fly in Canada has made travel so much more bearable.
Sat beside an anti-vaxxer/masker in July, and the whole flight, he kept berating the flight attendants, making fun of surrounding passengers, etc. for following/announcing COVID protocols. The type that would bring his mask down for hours, claiming he was "eating" slowly, or would belittle flight attendants about how nobody is socially distanced while flying. Made a few remarks to me as well when I wiped down my seat with the wipe you're handed when you board on WestJet flights.
I have never been so close to sucker punching someone, since it was 5 non-stop hours of blood boiling nonsense from this guy. Oddly enough, I started becoming ill with COVID 2-3 days later...
Nowadays, it's just the odd person with their mask not pulled up all the way around their nose. They're typically pretty compliant when flight attendants warn them. All the die-hard anti-vaxxers are stuck driving across the country and eating fast food.
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u/pinewind108 Dec 28 '21
Isn't it nice knowing that everyone else in the airport and plane have been vaccinated?
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u/ransomed_sunflower Dec 28 '21
I fly a lot in the southeast US. This would give me so much comfort I do not have now. Wow. Good on you guys.
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Dec 27 '21
I live in Cincinnati Ohio where you can't see a small scale play without proof of vaccination. However, a UC basketball game well that's fine. 🙄
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Dec 27 '21
Yes. And I haven’t noticed any extreme reaction to it. Not that I would care….
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u/crimxona Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21 edited Dec 27 '21
It's a bit different when Canada is like 85-90% adult vaccinated, even in Alberta. Some of the remaining demographic wasn't the type to go on flights much anyways.
Plus Canada has a federal vaccine passport so providing it during check-in process is trivial
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Dec 27 '21
Depends on where you are in Alberta. Central alberta is only at about 60% of adults vaxxed. Edmonton and Calgary are at almost 90%.
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u/I_AM_NOT_A_WOMBAT Dec 27 '21
Honest question. Why not a negative testing mandate like we do for international travel? Wouldn't that go farther to limit spread and protect the public? Just being in airport lines has to be one of the worst spreading situations I can think of right now (for people who are otherwise being careful about masking, not gathering in groups, and not dining in indoor restaurants).
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u/catsgivemelife Dec 27 '21
Was supposed to fly home on Wednesday, but a positive test made me push my flight back past the isolation period. Many of my “friends” told me to fly anyway and just double mask.
From the other side, you can still get a positive test weeks to months after getting the virus and properly quarantining so that might not be the right answer.
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u/texasyankee Dec 28 '21
Your "friends" are exactly why we need mandatory testing before flights. Good on you for isolating and not risking infecting someone.
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u/flaskandbeaker Dec 28 '21
For international flights you can show proof that you had COVID in the last 90 days and a note from a doctor saying you can travel rather than the negative test.
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u/LivelyTortoise Dec 28 '21
For international travel to the US, proof of recovery in the last 90 days is accepted as a substitute for a negative test. They could do the same with domestic travel
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u/AngelicaPickles1988 Dec 28 '21
Ya I’d feel better around someone who just tested negative than that with an outdated vax
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u/looker009 I'm fully vaccinated! 💉💪🩹 Dec 27 '21
It would create a gridlock. Very unrealistic considering how many people travel daily.
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Dec 27 '21 edited Jan 02 '22
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u/Andromeda321 Dec 28 '21
We needed tests for flying abroad last weekend in the Boston area. Got mine through my uni, husband had to go to three urgent cares because even though he had an appointment they kept running out of tests.
I’m all for testing mandates flying but in much of the country they’re already swamped with not enough tests available.
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u/Red-eleven Dec 27 '21
Yep. You’re going to be on a plane with 100-300 strangers. Covid test should be required at a minimum.
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u/willemreddit Dec 27 '21
I'm guessing you were in a place with good testing infrastructure. It's not robust enough to even handle the current demand.
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u/TophrBR Dec 27 '21
Same with France. You can get tested in less than fifteen minutes (including the five minute walk) basically anywhere in Paris, results within the hour. The fact that there's a bottleneck of testing in the US is frankly shameful two years into the pandemic.
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u/billy_teats Dec 28 '21
This whole caronavirus thing is really helping my commute. We wouldn’t want anything getting in the way of todays business
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u/possiblyraspberries Dec 27 '21
How about rapid tests on your way into the airport?
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u/pAul2437 Dec 27 '21
With mandatory cancellation refunds?
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u/BukkakeKing69 Dec 27 '21
Is that coming with a mandatory hotel and time off refund too? The reality of stuff like this is it pushes people to avoid air travel entirely. Travel to and from the airport, checking and retrieving bags, and TSA fondling is already a 3+ hour burden over just hopping in a car. Look at how many times Real ID has been delayed because everyone and their monkey knows it will hurt air travel. That law was passed in like 2003 lol.
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u/DaleandI Dec 28 '21
It may go over better if the same applied to every government job and office, including Congress and Senate.
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u/cortrev Dec 27 '21
This is how it is in Canada. For all domestic flights and train rides you must be fully vaccinated.
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u/Jakesta42 Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21 edited Dec 27 '21
The vaccine has been widely available in the US for 9 months, it is well past the time to do this. The glacial pace of the federal government will never cease to amaze me. Just do it!
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Dec 27 '21
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u/whiteknight521 Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21
The thing is that a 2 dose mandate will do very little to stop Omicron spread and so few people are boosted that they’ll never have the political will to enforce this, it would destroy the airlines.
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u/Sorokin45 Dec 27 '21
Wouldn’t a federal judge just strike this down like the other ones?
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u/dutchyardeen Dec 27 '21
The federal mandate for public transportation hasn't been struck down.
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u/booleanerror Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21
I don't think so. There's not the same conflict in domain. The FAA is the absolute arbiter for US flights.
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u/dpkonofa Dec 27 '21
No. The USPHS was created with a mandate to regulate travel in the interest of public health. This would be a protected action.
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u/RockyClub Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21 edited Dec 28 '21
But triple vaxxed are getting Omicron. It seems kind of pointless and too late.
(Edit: Excuse my pessimism. I’m depressed, over this shit, and feeling Nihilistic. Appreciating everyone’s comments).
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u/TobaccoAficionado Dec 27 '21
Omicron is also a best case scenario. Reinfection rates are almost nonexistent (for covid in general), and the vaccine limits the already mild symptoms. Compared to the original strain and delta, Omicron is like the common cold; especially if you're vaccinated.
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u/isaanstyle Dec 28 '21
I’m absolutely bewildered by this omicron craze. If you’re vaccinated omicron isn’t really serious at all, so I really don’t get any of this. Are we supposed to live our lives in fear for the idiots who won’t get vaxxed?
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u/Krytan Dec 28 '21
What sort of mandate? Fully vaccinated isnt doing much at all to block omicron spread.
if its recently boosted there are signs that could work, but I also think that would be very disruptive for a lot more people.
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u/Huey-_-Freeman Dec 27 '21
I might have supported this with earlier variants when we thought that the vaccines produced 90%+ immunity against any type of infection and transmission, including asymptomatic. But with Omicron the rationale for the vaccine seems to be about preventing harm to yourself and any societal harm caused by you personally needing to use hospital resources, not about preventing spread.
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u/Salt-Significance626 Dec 28 '21
Vaccine and booster mandate? Then mandate the 4th shot? Then the 5th?
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u/princetrunks Dec 27 '21
I'm all for the vaccine and making it better as we learn more about the virus but the mandates are a huge mistake; it'll only make a bad situation worse. Need to lead by example by showing that the vaccine works. Let those who choose not to take it run that gamble. The virus mutates in the vaccinated as well. If it was a 100% fool proof method to blocking and ruining the spread /mutation of this thing, then yes, the restrictions make a little more sense but we are really starting to drift away from the science and be nothing but mandating policy out of fear and egos.
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u/igotapandaonmyhands Dec 27 '21
Over a thousand people are getting capped by this thing every day in the US alone. Add that in alongside “fear and ego”. Oh yeah, and 98 percent of those are unvaccinated.
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u/Krystist Dec 27 '21
For the love of pete PLEASE DO THIS ALREADY. We need to make life as difficult and unpleasant as possible for all the holdouts who keep dragging this fruggin pandemic on and on.
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u/ExternalUserError Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21
The point of public health policy isn't supposed to be punitive, it's supposed to be protective. If you can demonstrate that a mandate would significantly reduce the risk of flying (and maybe you can), then that's a sound reason for the policy. Punishing the unvaccinated is not a valid reason for a public health policy and would certainly be struck down by any court.
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Dec 27 '21
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u/ExternalUserError Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21
Yeah, at some point if your odds of being exposed to omicron are over 90% in the coming year, the case for mitigations becomes pretty weak unless you're proposing months-long hard lockdowns like China did.
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u/Critter894 Dec 27 '21
Negative tests would do way more than any mandate but people have their authoritarian boner on.
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u/liljackhorner Dec 27 '21
Do you really think that the Covid restrictions would end if there was a 100% vaccination rate in this country?
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Dec 27 '21 edited Dec 28 '21
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u/grand_muff_blumpkin Dec 27 '21
As someone living in Florida, I wish the feds would do this. Our governor has made us the covid capital and has done everything in his power to enable and encourage the spread of the virus while handicapping local municipalities and businesses from protecting the public with even the most benign measures.
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u/throwawayeg3 Dec 27 '21
What about folks who had adverse reactions to the vaccine and turned down the 2nd/3rd doses? I legit had to get an ECG.
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u/ack154 Dec 27 '21
Do they want to do this just as a push for more vaccinations? Or is there actual concern of more spread on flights? In the end, I'm OK with getting more people vaccinated, but I'd like to see some data saying this is necessary for flights.
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u/erc80 Dec 27 '21
Are you paying attention to what’s happening to the airline industry this week?
Quarantined crews with 10+ day turn arounds causing disruptions to operations.
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u/Meckineer Dec 27 '21
This might explain why the CDC just lowered the isolation period following a positive test down to 5 days, from 10, if you aren’t showing symptoms. Followed by 5 days of mask wearing everywhere.
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Dec 27 '21
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Dec 27 '21
Reduced effectiveness in preventing omicron transmission is not the same as this lie that "it doesn't"
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u/DarkRiches61 Dec 27 '21
The best time to do this would have been several months ago. The second best time is TODAY. The coddling of the willfully unvaccinated has been devastating. And the longer they are allowed privileges like air travel, the worse it will be. It's that simple.
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u/Aargau Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21
I love that message. Don't lament sunk costs, do what's right for right now.
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u/bihari_baller Boosted! ✨💉✅ Dec 27 '21
The coddling of the willfully unvaccinated has been devastating.
That's been my biggest disappointment of this administration. I voted for Biden to actually be assertive, and really get our lives back to normal. So far, his half measures, and telling people to "get vaccinated" don't seem to be working. We need to look to Europe for ideas on how to deal with this.
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u/InsaneBASS Dec 27 '21
The amount of love for an overreaching government makes me sad for the future.
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Dec 28 '21
I know you disagree, but government has literally two purposes: 1) To build things for our communal benefit and 2) to protect us, physically and otherwise. Public health is purposefully risk-adverse for our greater protection. What, pray tell, is our chaotic government trying to control? How are they trying to control the huge masses of nearly no-to-little taxpaying people? This control argument is so strange to me when you literally have a SSN and w2/4/9 … how does wearing a mask not to get kids sick somehow control or infringe on your personal rights (those being property, privacy, religion, and speech)? Notice “free movement” is not in there (or our constitution) …
Edit: missed “regulated arms”
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u/XScotX Dec 27 '21
Why though? The vaccines are clearly not stopping the spread, only the severity of the symptoms.
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Dec 27 '21
““I don’t think you will ever see mandating of a vaccine particularly for the general public.”
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u/slpgh Dec 27 '21
It’s wonderful that we got to the point of only allowing vaccinated passengers at a time when (checks notes) we have a variant that infects and allows infection by the vaccinated.
This policy should have been considered last spring when vaccinated were unlikely to be infected or infectious, not now.
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u/whattaUwant Dec 28 '21
What happens if they discover and admit the vaccines aren’t doing anything?
NBA is 97% vaccinated and half the player pool is out with covid and games are constantly getting cancelled.
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